Police excess in Hungary: Two recent stories

I said a couple of days ago that I had gained the impression that  members of the Hungarian police force have been emboldened in the last three years. They feel that the government believes in strict rules and often opts for punishment as an answer to social ills. Since most of the police force are Jobbik and Fidesz supporters, they believe that Sándor Pintér’s ministry of the interior as well as the cabinet as a whole are behind them. They have a free hand, and they take advantage of it.

The policemen who beat to death a most likely innocent man in Orgovány were actually admired by the townspeople because they were known as tough policemen. And policemen are supposed to be tough. Of course, this murder was an extreme case. Still, the hardening of the police toward the people they are supposed to defend is widespread and appears to be intensifying. Let me describe two recent cases to give a taste of what I mean.

A month ago two university students were heading home from Budapest to Szeged. They were planning to hitch a ride and, while waiting, decided to have a cheeseburger at a roadside fast food joint. They settled down on the grass to have a bite. They hadn’t even finished their burgers when two policemen arrived. It turned out that one of the students didn’t have his ID card with him. Both of them received fines of 50,000 forints ($228), one for the missing ID card and the other for littering. This was the highest possible fine for such offences. The so-called litterer was told to throw his bag, which still had half of his cheeseburger in it, into the trash and to pick up litter, like an empty cigarette box, that didn’t even belong to them.

The scene of the "crime." The rest stop at Budaörs

The scene of the “crime” in Budaörs

At that point the poor devil made the mistake of saying “Ne már!,” meaning “Come on!” The policemen considered this to be resistance to police orders and handcuffed him. The fellow who didn’t have his ID card received the same treatment. They were escorted to the nearest police station, where they received the papers that obliged them to pay the fine. One of the boys decided to work off the penalty. He had to work 60 hours in Szeged picking up trash from parks.

Here is another case that is even more bizarre. It happened in Zalaegerszeg. A teacher crossed the street with her seven-year-old daughter, not at the designated crossing. She was in a hurry because she had to pick up her younger child from kindergarten. Moreover, they also had to catch the long distance bus to get to the village where they live. As it happens, there are only two crossings on this one-way street, both very far from the bus stop. Daily hundreds and hundreds of people cross here illegally because the city planners neglected to mark a crossing where it should have been. Right across from the bus stop.

The infamous bus stop in Zalaegerszeg

The infamous bus stop in Zalaegerszeg

In any case, she decided to cross illegally when she heard someone shouting behind her, “Come back!” There were two policemen who then decided to ask for her ID. It was pouring rain, the little girl was crying, and the policemen kept calling her by her first name and I guess used the informal “te” although she asked them several times to use her proper name and the formal. She cooperated but asked them to hurry because she had to pick up her little boy from kindergarten. The answer was that they will detain her as long as they want. They can take her to the police station and hold her there for twelve hours. The procedure took 20 minutes and naturally she missed closing time at the kindergarten. In the end, she was fined 20,000 forints.

The woman’s colleagues encouraged her to report her treatment by the two policemen, which she did. She came to regret that decision. The policemen’s superiors sided with the policemen. But that wasn’t enough. She was informed in this official letter that because she had crossed the road illegally with a seven-year-old child and thus endangered the child’s life her case had been passed on to the public guardianship authority. Subsequently she received several threatening letters from the guardianship authority. The message was that they can take her children away and place them with relatives or foster parents or put them in a state institution.

At this point the woman consulted a lawyer. The lawyer told reporters covering this story that in his long career he hadn’t encountered anything like this case. And the saga only continued. One day officials from the guardianship office appeared at her house, where they insisted on looking around. They wanted to see the children’s bedrooms, their clothes, their toys, their report cards, their records of inoculations. In order to impress them she told them that the children receive religious instruction, take private English lessons, and attend music school. Yes, yes, said the officials, they see that the children’s situation is perfectly satisfactory, but they “have to follow instructions.”

The illegal street crossing took place sometime in May, but it was only in the second week of September that the case was at last closed. But how? She didn’t simply get a letter informing her of the verdict. She had to appear in person in city hall where she was told the final outcome of the case.

I might add here that until recently Hungarian children who were placed under guardianship usually ended up in large institutions. Hungary is now obliged as a member of the European Union to end this practice and to try to place as many children as possible in foster homes. Viktor Orbán’s state doesn’t trust the foster parents, however, and just lately took away all their rights. They cannot act on behalf of the child. For example, from here on foster parents can’t decide on the schooling of the children in their care. Even children’s medical treatment will depend on officially designated guardians, guardians who will have to oversee at least 30 children. In addition, foster parents will have to take a 500-hour course in child rearing which will cost 300-500,000 forints.

It seems that Orbán’s Hungary simply doesn’t want to hand over these children to private citizens although we know that most of the troubled 20-30-year-olds are the products of state institutions. Not only is the state not a good owner, it is not a good parent either.

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tappanch
Guest

Dear Eva,

If I am not mistaken, the Constitutional Court ruled in the 1990s that pedestrian Hungarians do not have to carry their IDs with them. Of course, this was a pre-2010 ruling, it might be invalidated by the demise of the Constitution.

Paul
Guest

Is it really illegal to cross roads anywhere but at a designated crossing?

If so, I have been breaking the law a hell of a lot for a very long time!

You’d get a riot if you tried that one on in the UK.

An
Guest

Orban and his government embody this attitude: the people are there to serve the government, and not the government is there to serve the people. If that’s the prevailing thinking in the upper layers of the government, of course it just reinforces such attitudes among the police. There are always people among the police who tend to be heavy-handed, but now not only such behavior is tolerated, but it is becoming the accepted norm. The country has become a breeding ground for mini-dictators and persons of authority abusing their power… because they can. Because that’s what they see how it is done on higher levels, too.

petofi
Guest

It’s time to face reality: the Rule of Law is nothing; might is everything. If you have the backing of the government, such as the police in almost every instance, you can act as you wish.

Ladies and Gentlemen, welcome to the Rule of the Jungle, or, Might is Right. Nothing unusual here, just the stripping of society of about 1500 years of civilizing advancements.

HAJRA MAGYAROK!!

gdfxx
Guest

Paul :
Is it really illegal to cross roads anywhere but at a designated crossing?
If so, I have been breaking the law a hell of a lot for a very long time!
You’d get a riot if you tried that one on in the UK.

Don’t worry, in the UK there is no law against it. This website gives a little window on jaywalking laws around the world: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jaywalking .

I know that the only place I’ve seen jaywalking laws being enforced by police was in Transylvania during the Ceausescu years. It was another method to instill fear into people. So, here is another similarity between Orban and Ceausescu.

In most other places the police has more important tasks to take care of…

Guest
Tyrker
Guest

Do not forget the – also recent – case of a 70-year-old Kaposvár granny who, having failed to identify herself, was handcuffed, beaten up, taken to a local police station, stripped naked and held captive for three hours:

http://hir.ma/belfold/bunugy/70-eves-nenit-a-rendorok-megbilincseltek-majd-meztelenre-vetkoztettek-kaposvaron-videoval/117448

That being said, the conduct of the Hungarian police has never been exemplary and it is questionable whether it’s gotten any worse in the past three years. Your assertion that most of the police force are Fidesz supporters does not seem to be well founded, either – au contraire, police officers feel humiliated by the “Nullification Act,” angered by years of anti-police propaganda by Fidesz, and betrayed because of the abolishment of their early retirement plan.

hongorma
Guest

Everyone who possibly can is leaving.

James Atkins
Guest

To be fair, there are idiots and scumbags in the police all over the world, even in the most civilised countries. There’s something about the police force which makes it a place where cruel, dim and obedient people can get on ok, although obviously a lot of very good, well meaning and thoughtful people also work there.

Nicky
Guest

It occurred to me that it could have been even worse for the mother of 2 children. If she missed the kindergarten closing time,she was obviously picking her children up, or after, the ‘legal’ time of 4 o’clock. Had it been earlier,they could have asked for proof that her 7 year old child was exempted from school (compulsory after-school care) – or maybe that did happen,I don’t know. Anyway, the whole case of authorities visiting her home,and asking for all those papers,etc..is shocking. Vaccination records!? Whatever next! (by the way, Hungary has an extremely strict vaccination policy,that could have been another potential problem,if not all vaccinations had been carried out)
It’s pretty scary to consider that crossing a road in the wrong place with your child before 4pm could get you into a lot of trouble with the law.

Guest

Not too much OT I hope regarding a Hungarian policeman. It’s a strange story I stumbled on accidentally – I hope you believe that I don’t usually read the Telegraph …

“Daughter of former beauty queen and London socialite Eva Rhodes believes a Hungarian policeman had a motive for her murder, an inquest heard”

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/hungary/10366398/Daughter-of-Eva-Rhodes-believes-police-office-had-motive-for-murder.html

tappanch
Guest

New maps & website about elections in Budapest between 1920 and 1945:

http://www.bpvalaszt.hu/terkep.php?id=5

oneill
Guest

I am not sure the police are any worse now than 5 or 10 years previously. In my own personal experience I have seen some downright corruption (shaking down for trivial motoring violitions) and actually some really humane helpfulness which went well beyond the usual call of duty

Problem is the inconsistency and the wild-west ( or putinesque) attitude of the regime to the concept of law and order.

Orbanistan has so many petty and unnneccesary rules that if a copper were to stop me tomorrow for the crime of unauthorized breathing of Our Beloved Motherland’s Air then I would be quite prepared to believe him that such a law is now in existance

The other point I have noticed is the fact that there is quite obviously no fitness or general physical tests to pass before you can join the force. I would bet serious money on myself being able to outrunning 95% of the cops on the Budapest beat.

Ron
Guest

oneill: I would bet serious money on myself being able to outrunning 95% of the cops on the Budapest beat.

Or security guards?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xeTfrCKi2XI

Bank robbery in 13th district.

Kirsten
Guest

Ron, hilarious :-).

Ivan
Guest

Absolute nonsense law.

So, it’s midninght in rural or suburban Hungary … the roads are empty, the road is narrow … Am I supposed to walk x number of miles to find a poorly painted zebra crossing (where no vehicle will likely stop anyway and where traffic coming quite legally from a blind spot to my right can mow me down) … for fear that my children will be taken from me if I DON’T?

Yes. Midnight in Hungary.

GO
Guest

It’s an overly harsh sentence. But is it worth an article on a political blog? This is an everyday occurrence. Everywhere.

oneill
Guest

When Orban’s fascist enforcers threaten to take your kids away for the crime of jaywalking, yes, I think it is worth an article.

Guest

GO :
It’s an overly harsh sentence. But is it worth an article on a political blog? This is an everyday occurrence. Everywhere.

The political implication of the story is that the minister in charge of the police should be fired. That would happen everywhere else.

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