Fidesz attack on the Hungarian Helsinki Commission and conditions in the Debrecen refugee camp

Just the other day Viktor Orbán’s friend Vladimir Putin signed a new law against “undesirable” NGOs. The law gives Russian authorities the power to shut down foreign-financed organizations, introduce fines, and even mete out jail time of up to six years for those who violate the law. This new law further restricts the activities of NGOs financed in part by foreign donors. The 2012 law affected 60 groups that were branded “foreign agents.”

Hungary is not far behind Russia when it comes to harassment of non-governmental groups that receive foreign financing. Some of them, especially those that deal with human rights issues, are under constant siege. The latest attack is on the Hungarian Helsinki Commission.

The occasion for Fidesz’s assault is a dispute over the origins of immigrants coming from outside the European Union. Under normal circumstances it wouldn’t warrant such an outburst on the part of the government party. In fact, the text of the press release reminded Hungarians of the darkest days of the Rákosi regime.

The pseudo-civic Helsinki Commission, which fulfills the political orders of the international financial speculators, brazenly tries to falsify black-and-white facts. As opposed to their lies, the fact is that four-fifths of those seeking refugee status, 35,000 people, don’t arrive in Hungary from war zones. They come only for the money. This year only 17.3% of the arrivals came from war zones, and hence the great majority of those who illegally cross the border are not political refugees.

We call on the Helsinki Commission to stop lying and at least in such an important and serious question not be preoccupied with stuffing their pockets with the money of György Soros.

The terms used here to describe the evil forces of international finance, with their anti-Semitic overtones, could be found daily in the notorious party newspaper of the early 1950s, Szabad Nép.

What makes Fidesz so jumpy that it feels compelled to release a Soviet-style rant about something that may have been a simple misunderstanding? There is a good possibility that it has something to do with the Hungarian Helsinki Commission’s involvement in the investigation into the circumstances in which refugees are forced to live in the Debrecen refugee camp.

It was about a month ago that Ombudsman László Székely and his associates investigated the situation in the Debrecen camp, and it is likely that the investigation was prompted by a request from the Hungarian Helsinki Commission. The report that was published in April is an indictment of the conditions in the camp. And that was enough for the Fidesz types to lash out at the “troublemakers.”

In the first place, the camp is terribly overcrowded. The facility can handle a maximum of 807 individuals, but right now there are 1,188 men, women, and children living in the former barracks that serves as a refugee camp. Although Viktor Orbán wants to close the Debrecen camp, an association formed to assist refugees and migrants is trying to convince the government to enlarge the facility.

The Debrecen camp has two sections. One is for people who can leave the camp during the day. There is, however, also a closed section, which is actually a glorified jail. The people held there didn’t commit any crime. They are the “lucky” ones whose refugee status is being contemplated by the Hungarian authorities. The rationale for their incarceration is the authorities’ demand that they be available at all times for “speedy decision making.” They can be kept captive for as long as six months. At the time of the ombudsman’s investigation, there were 65 people in this section. All, with the exception of one couple, were families with children from Kosovo.

A room in the Debrecen refugee camp

A room in the Debrecen refugee camp

The closed section of the camp is surrounded by a 3m-high solid fence, topped with barbed tape–a mesh of metal strips with sharp edges. The inhabitants are watched 24 hours a day by policemen situated in six guard rooms placed along the inside of the wall. The guards seem to do a thorough job screening new arrivals. For example, women complained that they had to strip naked in front of male guards. Apparently, when a family arrives in the camp, policemen strip search them as a group. So, the father and mother have to strip naked in front of their children. The armed guards even follow the new arrivals to their medical examinations.

There is a room where children can play for a few hours, but even these small children are under constant surveillance. Although the section in which these families are kept has plenty of rooms, the authorities often put two or three families in a single room. There are rooms in which a family with three children, along with a couple without children, have to live. Men can shave for only an hour–from 9 p.m.–and the act is again watched by armed guards. After the men finish shaving, the guards collect the razors. The next day these razors are haphazardly distributed to the “inmates.” Families with children have a hard time keeping clean. Although there is a room where they are supposed to be able to use an old-fashioned washing machine, the officials had difficulty even producing the key to the room. From the look of room inside, it was clear that the place hasn’t been used lately.

Viktor Orbán was terribly upset when some members of the European Parliament dared to bring up the treatment of Hungarian refugees in 1956. He indignantly announced that those 200,000 people who fled after the Soviets decided to quell the uprising “escaped from Soviet tanks.” Well, let’s face it, most of those refugees left Hungary in the hope of a better life. There were of course some who could be considered bona fide political refugees, but relatively few.

As for the treatment of the 56ers, let me give you a few examples from my own experience. In Eisenstadt, which was a major collection center, I was asked whether I would like to go to Wienerneustadt or the Alps. It was not a difficult choice. We received train tickets to the Carinthian Alps, where a Volkswagen bus took us to Weißensee, the highest mountain lake in Austria. There we were housed in a comfortable Gasthaus. There was only one couple with us, and naturally they received separate quarters. From our mountain resort we used to go to the nearest village, where the owner of the movie theater made it a point to order films with Hungarian themes. He never accepted any money from us. Once two of the boys returned from the village with brand new shoes because the owner of the local store had noticed that their shoes were in bad shape. When in Vienna, we didn’t have to pay for tickets on streetcars and buses and received a weekly stipend. We received meal tickets in restaurants owned by the city of Vienna, where the food was as good as any decent restaurant. Compare our welcome in Austria to the way the miserable people in the closed section of the Debrecen camp are being treated.

But since the Hungarian Helsinki Commission had the temerity to call attention to the unacceptable conditions in the so-called refugee camp, they must be part of an international conspiracy.

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Izsák
Guest

Thank you, Eva! You are so important for us!

Guest
It is unlikely that Albanian Kosovars would seek refuge/immigrant status in Hungary; these days they have much better options for entering the EU. It is also unlikely that Serbian Kosovars would seek refuge/immigrant status in Hungary; they are more likely to just move over to Serbia, then go work in the EU from there. This leaves just the Kosovar Roma, who are a despised, and on occasion actively persecuted minority in Kosovo. Could it be that the actual main reason for the extreme unwillingness of the Hungarian government to put out any kind of a welcome mat for the people incarcerated in the Debrecen camp, is the fact that they are Balkan Gypsies? This would certainly explain the hysterical tone of the press release re the Hungarian Helsinki Commission spotlighting the plight of the inmates in the Debrecen camp. A more general point is that the post-Holocaust Western consensus on refugees and human rights is today under enormous strain due to rapid globalization having moved developed countries cheek-by-jowl with underdeveloped ones, where misrule, incompetence, corruption, extreme ideologies and terrorism is rife, as a result of which literally tens of millions of desperate brown and black people are banging on the… Read more »
petofi
Guest

Mike’s excellent comment brings to mind what a Balkan person told me some 10 years ago: “The Moslem states will flood the western countries with Moslem refugees and will use their rapid reproduction ratios to take over countries in a few generations.”

Sharia Law, anyone? …in Britain? …in France?…in Canada?

It doesn’t seem so crazy now, does it?

It’s time for the West to take its head out of the sand: the clash of civilization is being taken seriously..at least by one side, anyway.

Realitycheck
Guest

Well crazy might depend on how you define a “flood”.

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2015/01/15/5-facts-about-the-muslim-population-in-europe/

And did you know that the birthrates of Muslims in Europe is declining? This is typically what happens to immigrants from less developed countries when they settle in a developed country.

And regarding “facts”.

http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2014/oct/29/todays-key-fact-you-are-probably-wrong-about-almost-everything

Non-Muslims tend to be particularly bad at getting the facts straight regarding the Muslim population in their country.

http://static.guim.co.uk/ni/1414524513816/Perception_MUSLIM.svg

Guest

@Mike Balint
May 26, 2015 at 9:41 pm

Small amendment of clause in third paragraph:

“… where misrule, incompetence, corruption, extreme ideologies, terrorism, hopeless poverty and an utter lack of prospects prevail, …”

Guest

Re: the fear of unrestricted immigration

You know it would seem to me that the two brother ‘dictators’ , Vlad and Vic, really have a sense of no nonsense when it comes to dealing with other nationalities and peoples who are desperate to leave their countries. Not their problem. Let ‘Europe’ handle and fester in it.

What appears to count more now is to get all Magyars and Russians into their own tidy folds, all nice and homogenized. Who needs complications? Nothing like ‘dictators’ thinking alike and being on the same page. Something tells me this happened once before with some chaotic happenings occurring. We live in interesting times.

And a Russian fantasy:

Vlad’s Mediterranean fleet offering free Russian travel services to the desperate in their time of toil and trouble.

Mirza
Guest
Hi, I usually don’t leave any comments and instead read this blog and its comments as a source of news. However, today I found the comments posted by @petofi and @Balint very disturbing. First you adhere to a neocolonialist concept, clash of civilization, and then bring a comment from a “Balkan person” about Muslim take over, and finally make yourself afraid/convinced and spread Fox news propaganda about Sharia Law in France and Britain. How is this different from conspiracy theories about Jews? Your generalizations about “black and brown” people are not acceptable. Don’t you see the kind of fear of “other” that you expressed makes your conclusions similar to that of Orban’s? The same person you mock? Eva I don’t know about your experience in Austria and the U.S, but as a refugee in Hungary I usually go through the following routine: -No, I don’t support Sharia law. -No, I am not going to bring the rest of my “Muslim” family because most of people fleeing from “misrule, incompetence, corruption, extreme ideologies, terrorism, hopeless poverty and an utter lack of prospects prevail” go to neighboring regions and not Europe. -No, I am not lying. You may refer to UNHCR’s report… Read more »
Guest

Thank you, Mirza!

petofi
Guest

@ Mirza

Sorry, but facts are facts: for the last ten years at least, there have been mosques going up all over Toronto. Would it come as a surprise to you that Moslem terrorism has been found leaving the front door of mosques in Britain, France, Canada and the USA? Another fact: Sharia Law exists in about 30 regions of France. Canadian fact: attempts are being made to establish Sharia Law in some western regions of Canada. Now, multiculturalism is national policy in Canada; but undermining the Canadian legal system is a whole different thing. Let’s be clear about one thing: practicing your culture is one thing, supplanting the legal practices of a country is something else.

Appealing to the knee-jerk reactions of the ‘politically-correct’ will not always work with everyone, sir.

Guest

Petofi, Please state your sources for these statements.

petofi
Guest

@Gretchen

We’re on the ‘attack’, are we?
Well, do your own research: the above is general knowledge.
What is your problem? That mosques are a hotbed of Moslem terrorism? What kind of proof would you like?
That mosques are popping up all over Toronto, and other places in Canada?
Check the stats yourself.
That moslem birthrate is way above the norm of western countries?

What do you need: the obvious tattooed on your forehead?

Member
Just because new mosques are being built as are many churches in general, cannot be considered any proof of what you are saying. There is extremism in many faiths. Also, I would like to point out to you that unless you are a first nations people of Canada, you have 0.00% right to claim any sort of ethnic rights to the country of Canada. You also have 0.00% right to claim that any “white” faith is above any other in this country. As a whole Canada was built and developed by people of all faiths and ethnicities. We all have the same rights under the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms. I will not allow my fellow Canadians to be labelled in any way shape or form including you sir. In fact it is people who hold the views you do that come to this country and bring your racist, bigoted views with you. This makes you no better in my eyes than those with extremist views of any kind that come to this great country and poison others with your extremism. This is not about being politically correct, it is about realizing that we are all here as a… Read more »
Member

I hereby declare that I will henceforth read no more of @petofi’s comments on Hungarian Spectrum; just skip over them. Bigotry is odious and so is the rude, crude style of many of these postings. Shame on you @petofi

googly
Guest
Petofi, I’ve checked the stats, and people of the muslim faith are still a tiny minority in all “western” countries except France and the UK, and they include converts to the faith as well. Also, the vast majority of them are not extremists, including the police officer in Paris who was killed after the Charlie Hebdo massacre. Sharia law has not supplanted the law in any “western” country, regardless of what you might have heard. All that has happened is that when all parties involved in a civil matter agree, they may use Sharia law to resolve their dispute, so long as it does not supersede any civil laws. I challenge you to link to an instance where something more than that has happened. Everything you write against people of the muslim faith could also be written about many ethnic groups, yet you probably would not do so, since you would rightly be labelled a racist. Do us a favor and stop libeling people of an entire faith, which was the official religion (though not the only religion practiced) of the only place of higher learning and tolerance during a significant period of European history. If only we could ask… Read more »
Member
Petofi, I also live in Canada and I will ensure you as I am very well travelled in the west and also a resident, there is absolutely NOT one shred of evidence of what you are talking about with regards to Muslims taking over. I also could ask you of what kind of news you hear that claims Sharia Law is being attempted in ANY community in the west. What you are doing is simply fear mongering. The west is quite a bit behind Toronto as a matter of fact except for the greater Vancouver area as to the abundance of cultures and Muslim people in general. What I have observed everywhere is that there is this shift in society due to the growth of the internet, is that there is so much bullshit floating around with such hate and misleading information regarding this that people don’t seem to know what to think. The truth is we must not pay any mind to the racist and biased hateful “news sources” available at our disposal at all times because we are heading down a dangerous road, the entire world is heading down a dangerous road and remember what is right and… Read more »
Realitycheck
Guest
Facts? Well not sure what is meant by applying Sharia law in Britain, France, Canada and the US? Perhaps it is something like the 200 diocesan tribunals the Roman Catholic church maintains in the US? Or the rabbinical courts used by some conservative Jews to obtain religious divorces, resolve business conflicts and settle other disputes, also found in the US? Do these supplant the legal practices of the state and federal courts of the US? No, they do not. Any decision made by these religious bodies can be overturned by US law. A Catholic court may not grant an annulment of a marriage or a rabbinical court may not grant a woman a divorce from her husband, but in either case there is the possibility of being heard outside of the religious tribunals. I am not sure about the facts regarding the alleged 30 regions of France and just exactly what form of Sharia law is practiced there by Muslims, but a less biased source would be welcomed by me too. What I do know is that these courts do not deal with criminal matters nor do they supersede a country’s civil or criminal codes. So, no need to fear… Read more »
Realitycheck
Guest

Let me add – What is Sharia law? It is certainly not uniformly practiced or applied. I would be horrified to learn that an ISIS or Taliban form of Sharia law is being applied in France. That is however not what we are talking about. Not even close.

Furthermore these religious tribunals only apply to willing practicers of the religion. Not the population as a whole.

Guest

Thanks, Liz and Realitycheck for your kind and clear words!
In most religions there are “fundamentalists” who don’t accept any one else – they are the real enemies!

Guest

@Mirza
May 27, 2015 at 5:25 am

Re your comment on @Balint above, I fear that you have (1) a serious reading comprehension problem and (2) an even more serious burying-your-head-in-the-sand problem.

And pray thee: what is the murderous struggle of Sunni Islamists against Shia Islamists, or that of Islamists against Christians, or that of Islamists against the entire modern world, but a clash of civilisations? (With Islamism being a perfectly valid, if fundamentalist interpretation of the doctrines of Islam, and a perfectly faithful imitation of the actions of its Prophet.

And by the way, what exactly is “neo-colonialist”?

Gimme a break.

googly
Guest

Mike Balint,

It’s good to see you directing your blind, unfounded bigotry and hatred towards a people other than Hungarians, for a change.

It’s also good to see you up to your old tricks, such as declaring that Mirza has a “serious reading comprehension problem”, then not deigning to explain why or how. I could just as easily declare that you have no idea what you’re talking about when it comes to Islamism, or political Islam, and that you should stop embarrassing yourself in front of the readers of this blog. No need for me to explain – everyone else understands exactly what I’m talking about, so if you don’t, that’s not my problem!

spectator
Guest

Today I’ve learned something new – again – from the “Hungarian Brain Trust”, Thank you!

Eva quoted above:
his year only 17.3% of the arrivals came from war zones, and hence the great majority of those who illegally cross the border are not political refugees.

Now we’re all know, that if there is no “war zone” somewhere, the people fleeing from there can not be political refugees by definition, according to the Hungarian Government, that is.

So, those who dare to criticise some oppressive regime and forced to run for dear life as reward clearly will “come only for the money”, what else? After all, if there is no “war zone”, there couldn’t be any political reason to grant asylum – “logical” isn’t it?

Just as well as the hundreds of Hungarians who managed to flee during the ‘60s and ‘70s wrongly treated all over the World as political refugees, – there wasn’t war in Hungary, was it?

What a bunch of miserable morons running that poor country!

The intellectual darkness put any ‘dark hole’ into shame, without further effort, for sure..!

petofi
Guest

@spectator

“What a bunch of miserable morons running that poor country!”

True.

But imagine how much worse are the nincompoops supporting those ‘morons’,
AND cheering them on!

Hungary is a well nigh incomprehensible mixture of villainy and idiocy.

Guest

“Hungary is a well nigh incomprehensible mixture of villainy and idiocy.”

The villains dupe the idiots. I wouldn’t call that a mixture or incomprehensible.

spectator
Guest

However, ‘nice’ mixture, won’t you say?

It keep baffling me, why, oh why don’t – at least – they read their own statements?
Or it is really so, that nobody cares, either way?

I don’t think that my intelligence is over the average, but I see through the inconsistencies right away. How dare anybody release such brazen idiocy, without even think it over?

That’s why I volunteered with the definition “miserable morons” because no otherwise sane people with responsibility would ever do such thing.

Or I’m living in the past, when fotsal proficiency wasn’t enough merit to work in the Foreign Departement, and being a prodigy disguised to car repairman didn’t qualified to be a Senior Adviser of the Prime Minister…

Well, I’m disclosed – too old, you see!

tappanch
Guest

The Orban-Fidesz healthcare policies do yield results in reducing the social security expenses!

Fewer and fewer doctors, nurses, well-equipped hospitals do produce the intended results.

Deaths in Hungary, 2015 vs 2014:

January: + 17.2%
February: + 24.5% (wow!)
March: + 3.2%

First quarter: +14.6%

http://www.ksh.hu/docs/hun/xstadat/xstadat_evkozi/e_wdsd001.html

tappanch
Guest

Deaths / 100,000 people

1930: 15.5
1941: 13.2

1950: 11.4
1960: 10.2
1970: 11.6
1980: 13.6
1990: 14.0

2000: 13.3
2010: 13.0
2014. 12.8

2014 (1st quarter average): 13.6
2015 (1st quarter average): 15.6

http://www.ksh.hu/docs/hun/xstadat/xstadat_hosszu/h_wdsd001a.html

googly
Guest

Tappanch,

Thank you for posting these statistics so often. They do contribute to the discussion, and can be food for thought for those who don’t speak Hungarian.

In this case, however, in the interest of fairness, isn’t it possible that the numbers are changing because of demographics? Sort of like adjusting budget numbers for inflation, I’d like to see whether these higher mortality rates are really the result of government policy (which could very well be the case) or could be mostly or entirely attributed to fluctuating birth rates 70 years ago and in recent years. If there is a higher ratio of elderly to the general population, wouldn’t that be a possible factor?

I’m not attacking you, I just don’t like to see statistics misused or misinterpreted, and I don’t have the time to go searching through the available data to make this determination.

tappanch
Guest

Corruption in spending the Swiss aid (billing 230,000 CHF for free software in a “Tourismusprojekt” ):

http://www.tagesanzeiger.ch/schweiz/standard/Betrugsverdacht-in-Schweizer-Foerderprojekt-in-Ungarn——/story/22835815

petofi
Guest
@ Sharia Law in Canada For all those nay-sayers: website–http://www.billionbibles.org/sharia/canada-sharia-law.html Sharia law is advancing in Canada at both provincial and local levels. The provincial governments of Canada for years have tacitly recognized Sharia law for Canada’s Muslim minority by sending multiple welfare checks to polygamous Muslim men who raise multiple families in Canada. In 2003, Muslims in Ontario, the immigrant-rich province, attempted to make the government of Ontario set aside its laws and have only the Sharia law apply to Muslims. After a fierce debate, the Premier of Ontario eventually stepped in and pushed back against Sharia, at least for then. Efforts by Canadian Muslims to push for Sharia law at the municipal level have met more immediate success. Above is the scene at Valley Park Middle School, a public school in Toronto, Ontario in 2008 – a decade after Mark Harding took a stand against it. Instead of just a classroom, a cafeteria becomes a mosque on Friday afternoons so that Muslim students can listen to an imam from a nearby mosque and pray towards Mecca. In the photo, the boys are praying in front of the girls, who are praying in front of the menstruating girls, who are… Read more »
Guest

Thanks Petofi for this source. It appears to be an evangelical Christian site. If the children were required to attend their school on Sundays, the cafeteria might well become a Christian Sunday School. The only food that is or can be Halal in Islam is meat and it has to do with respectful and kind slaughter of the animal. Allah is not a ‘moon god’. I am sorry, but billionbibles is misinformed on this basic and easily found information, thus I must take the rest with that grain of salt.

petofi
Guest

Gretchen,

I did say there were other sources, not biblical, like the CBC, The Guardian and yet others, too.

Islamic encroachment is a world-wide reality.

Immigrants who come to Canada should be respectful of the government and the system of laws that they find there…or why not go elsewhere? But anyway, the point is that a host country ought to be respected, and not have its laws undermined.

One comes to Canada to live in a country of peace, stability, and good government, period.

petofi
Guest

Gretchen,

Don’t take the rest ‘with a grain of salt’. There are dates and places mentioned: if the facts are wrong, challenge them with better, or more correct, facts of your own. (And keep the salt for your cooking.)

Reality Check
Guest

I did. See links above. Please look at the stats and note the UN just asked the EU to accept 40,000 refugees. Please note how little that changes the population ratios in the EU.

Member

You demonstrate so perfectly how things get so out of hand with misinformation around the world. First of all, quit relying on the internet for all of your information. I know it is a great way of getting “quick info”, however, even mainstream media is written and interpreted individually. Get out and ask questions, talk to people who are involved in these communities. That way you are not getting second hand and possibly biased information. Even in Canada we have bigoted people who are just as extreme with their ideas as other places. We are not EVER going to have Sharia law in Canada, regardless of how many Muslim people want to practice it in their religions. Sharia will not and cannot replace any laws of Canada.

googly
Guest

Petofi, none of what is written in that (probably erroneous) article shows that “Sharia law” supersedes civil law anywhere in Canada. If the government chooses to provide welfare to women with children who happen to be wives of a muslim man, so what? I bet they provide welfare to women who have never been married, yet still have children. You would prefer that those children starve? Also, that school, if it exists, might be violating some kinds of laws, so you should look into filing suit. Don’t worry, the Sharia police won’t hunt you down and behead you.

If you’re worried about muslim people out-breeding you, then go and find more non-muslim women who would like to have children but can’t afford to, and subsidise their pregnancies. Of course, just because an immigrant has many children doesn’t mean that those children will also have many children. In my experience, they revert to the mean after a generation or two.

tappanch
Guest

May 2015: Show trial in Hungary, with a government sting operation against an opposition politician (MP). The charge is bribe, although no money changed hands.

http://nepszava.hu/cikk/1058513-dezsore-ment-ki-a-jatek

Istvan
Guest

The Islamic State is without question a huge threat to the world, but it is the greatest threat to those they consider apostates. These are primarily Arabic people even if believers in Islam that do not adhere to their interpretation of both the Quran and Hadith. What Petofi calls Sharia law is subject to interpretation by Fiqh (school of Islamic jurisprudence) that represents the process of deducing and applying sharia principles, as well as the collective body of specific laws deduced from sharia using the fiqh methodology. The Islamic State has declared apostate any scholar who disagrees with their adopted Fiqh.

Those in greatest danger for the imposition of the Islamic State’s understanding of Sharia are not Hungarians or white Christian Canadians, but Arabic people including Christians, Zoroastrians, Shiites, and many believers in Sunni Islam do not support what is called Wahhabism which is what is being propagated in the Islamic State. Most of those recruited to IS here in the USA became followers of the Wahhabis via the internet rather than in formal mosques.

Guest

Thank you Istvan, for naming the Muslim sect that is most restricted and narrow– the Wahabis. I have personally found them frightening. Islam, as I feel most religions are, is based on love. Not the Wahabis.

gdfxx
Guest
This topic resulted in the liveliest debate I’ve seen here in a long time. I would like to add my (literally) two cents: I guess the anti-Muslim sentiments among non-Muslims can be mainly explained by recent (and not so recent) manifestations of fundamentalist (and not so fundamentalist) Muslim groups. I would go back to my childhood reading of the novel Egri csillagok by Geza Gardonyi (probably known by most Hungarian reading people). I still have in front of me the image of violent and suicidal attacks by Turkish Muslim armies against Hungarian defenses. The defenders were pouring hot tar on them, and they kept climbing on the bodies, screaming the name of Allah. Recent acts by members of ISIS and similar groups did not help. And finally, the punishment for apostasy wherever Muslim law prevails is frightening, even when it is not death (but in many cases it is). This makes it almost impossible for a more enlightened group to take over, as it happened in other faiths, because the way various Muslim groups declare other groups to be non-Muslims makes this into a very dangerous move. The migration of the have-nots to the the areas inhabited by the haves… Read more »
Member

There unfortunately is a very big misconception that the Hungarian government is trying to make people believe that the EU and the western world wants to “open all borders” and welcome everybody as migrants immigrants or refugees. Can anyone provide a link to where it states this as a fact? I have only seen that there are refugee quotas based on the population of each country and for Hungary looks like it is barely asking them to take more than 300 people.

tappanch
Guest

Official data about asylum seekers in Hungary.

1st quarter of each year. Asylum seekers / refugee status granted

2011: 340 / 15
2012: 457 / 21
2013: 2,322 / 26
2014: 2,736 / 45
2015: 33,542 / 29

http://www.ksh.hu/docs/hun/xstadat/xstadat_evkozi/e_wnvn001.html

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