Hungarian politicians support their friends abroad

It seems that members of the Hungarian government don’t have enough to do at home. They feel compelled to get involved in controversies outside of the country. Today I’ll look at two such controversies, one involving a Spanish archbishop, the other the all-important British referendum on EU membership.

Cardinal Antonio Cañizares Llovera, the archbishop of Valencia, is not exactly a household name, but in Catholic circles he is well known as an arch-conservative who is described by Spain’s leading newspaper, El Pais, asa guardian of orthodoxy with an incendiary personality.” Earlier Cañizares was a typical Vatican bureaucrat and a favorite of Benedict XVI, who in 2008 named him head of the Congregation for Divine Worship. But with the pope’s resignation in 2013 his service in the Vatican came to an end. Pope Francis most likely found Cañizares far too conservative. After retiring from his Vatican job, he had to be satisfied with the archbishopric of Valencia, which is considered to be one of the lesser sees in Spain.

Cañizares often gets into trouble. For instance, in October 2015 he talked about the “invasion of immigrants” and wondered what immigration will do to Spain “in a few years.” Like so many other conspiracy theorists, he wanted to know “who is behind all this.” Earlier, in 2009, he claimed that abortion was worse than child abuse. Most recently, the archbishop lashed out at the LGBT community, feminism and gender ideology. In early June, in a homily titled “In defense and support of the family,” Cañizares said that the family, which is the most valued social institution, “is shaken to its foundations by serious, clear or subtle, threats.” In his opinion, Spanish legislation only aids attacks on the family, which is being threatened by “movements and actions of the gay empire, of ideas such as radical feminism, or the most insidious of all, gender theory.” Soon enough, pro-LGBT and feminist organizations in Spain announced that they intended to charge Cañizares with apologia, a term in Spanish law that means encouraging or defending a criminal act. On June 19 The Catholic Herald reported that Spanish feminist groups had called for the government to prosecute Cardinal Cañizares “for inciting discrimination and hatred.”

Cañizares’s remarks and what followed were reported outside of Spain mostly in Catholic publications, but the eagle-eyed Hungarian Christian Democratic youth organization (Ifjú Kereszténydemokraták or IKSZ) found the story. The president of the organization, who looks close to forty years old, issued an official public statement condemning all those “radical liberals” who objected to Cañizares’s description of the LGBT community as a “gay empire.” Young Hungarian Christian Democrats share the opinion of the cardinal and find it outrageous that “even the justice system assists ‘opinion terror’ of members of a tiny minority that call themselves human rights activists.”

In the opinion of KDNP, “the activities of the radical gay and feminist groups are harmful because they want to limit the freedom of expression and incite hatred.” Zsolt Semjén, chairman, and Miklós Soltész, vice chairman of the party, will extend an invitation to Cardinal Cañizares to visit Hungary sometime in the fall.

As usual, the Christian Democrats overreached. They have an urge to openly support the most orthodox ideas expressed within the Catholic Church. Commentators endorsing Cañizares’s position view this case as “an important, perhaps conclusive, litmus test. Will Pope Francis stand with Cardinal Cañizares?” No word has come so far from the Vatican, as the author sadly announced a couple of days ago. On the other hand, a Hungarian group that calls itself the CitizenGO team is collecting signatures online in defense of the beleaguered cardinal.

While the Christian Democrats are supporting the Spanish cardinal, Viktor Orbán is supporting his friend David Cameron. That “one of Europe’s most Eurosceptic leaders” urged Britons to vote to remain in the European Union was startling enough to warrant coverage by Reuters. The move is especially surprising since it was only a few days ago that János Lázár categorically stated that the Hungarian government will in no way commit itself one way or the other. Whatever the decision is, the Hungarian government will respect it. He added that any negative effect of a Brexit on the Hungarian economy and currency would not require the introduction of any short-term measures. At this point Zoltán Kovács, the government spokesman, interjected, assuring the audience that the country’s budgetary reserves can take care of all possible contingencies.

Brexit ad

So, great was the surprise when two and a half days later Kovács himself confirmed the news that the Hungarian government would place a full-page ad in the conservative Daily Mail today. In fact, the ad was originally supposed to appear in the Saturday edition, but because of Jo Cox’s murder it was postponed. Kovács’s explanation for the unusual campaign tactic was that a strong Europe can be built only with the cooperation of larger states. He recalled that Hungary was often accused of anti-European sentiment, but “its current pan-European attitude aptly demonstrates how resolutely and firmly [the Hungarian government] believes in the importance of the European Union’s achievements.”

The Hungarian media’s reaction to the contradictory messages was one of puzzlement. As one headline said: “It can only happen here that we don’t know whether we support England’s exit from the European Union or not.” Journalists approached the office of the prime minister for an explanation of the contradiction between Lázár’s announcement of neutrality and Orbán’s ad with his signature attached. The answer was that Orbán, by publishing the ad, is not trying to influence British public opinion. He only expresses “his point of view that we Hungarians are glad we are in an alliance of which the Brits are members. On the one hand, this is an honor because we are talking about a great nation, and on the other, we are also stronger if the Brits stay in the European Union. This is exactly what the ad emphasizes. The decision belongs to the Brits, but we let them know that Hungary is proud to be a member of the European Union alongside of them.”

Meanwhile it is quite clear that the right-wing of Fidesz and Jobbik are keeping fingers crossed for Great Britain to leave the Union. Pesti Srácok with ill-concealed glee announced today that those in favor of Brexit now have a slight lead. The article tries to calm Hungarian nerves by emphasizing that Great Britain’s exit wouldn’t have any serious consequences for Hungary and that those approximately 200,000 Hungarians living in Great Britain have nothing to fear because “those already living there arrived in the country legally.” The question is whether they would want to remain in the United Kingdom, because after Brexit “Great Britain would no longer be the same country they chose at the time of their arrival.” Alfahír, Jobbik’s official internet paper, sympathized with Nigel Farage, who “doesn’t back down.” The article published long quotations from Farage and some of those around him. It pointed to the “almost hysterical atmosphere created by the British media and the pro-EU political elite after Jo Cox’s death.” It doesn’t matter what Gábor Vona says about the party’s changed attitude toward the European Union, Jobbik would still gladly leave the Union and is therefore keeping fingers crossed for the pro-Brexit forces to win the referendum.

So, here we have two cases in which Hungarian reactions are questionable. Hungarian bishops often and in even more forceful terms than Cardinal Cañizares have gone against the wishes of Pope Francis on the refugee issue. Now the Christian Democratic Party, which considers itself the political arm of the Hungarian Catholic Church, has so much affinity with the arch-conservative Spanish archbishop that it feels compelled to extend an invitation to him to visit Hungary. At the same time Viktor Orbán has the temerity to get involved in a dispute that concerns only the citizens of Great Britain. I wonder what he would say if the European Union placed a full-page ad in a Hungarian newspaper urging people to vote against the anti-immigrant referendum he insists on holding. Perhaps one of the European prime ministers should try it. It would be fun.

June 20, 2016
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petofi
Guest

Nothing highlights the incomprehension, and idiocy, of the average Hungarian more than the games that Orban plays at home and abroad.
And of course, what they don’t understand, the salivating-followers ascribe to Orbans ‘deep thought’ and genius. How moronic!
And the peasant Hungarians are easily left adrift in the jive-ass dipsy-doodling of the master-est gypsy of them all.

Hajra Magyarok!!!

Member

Ceterum censeo, ugly racist remarks like petofi’s should indeed be deleted. His age is no excuse. It provides free fodder for pseudo-respectable criticism by semi-sophisticated trolls. Deprived of petofi’s mean-spirited acting-out, they would have only infantile tu-quoque non-sequiturs or triumphal “loser/winner” squawks to post in faux-righteous indignation about the US and UK to distract attention from the focus of Éva’s invaluable blog. Don’t suspend petofi’s posting rights: just remove traces of his spoor — as well as the counter-spoor it inspires, including posts like my own here: they should all be erased asap. How can we be pro-Roma and anti-racist if we indulge the Trumpian temptation to cast racial aspersions at Orban?

It might even help petofi re-learn some new, decent tricks, along the lines of his postings years ago, when he still exercised some control and judgment.

Guest

Maybe Petofi is the zeitgeist?

As Hungary descends into the abyss without any apparent indigenous concern Petofi is the mirror that sheds light on the Hungarian psyche?

Sometimes you have to call a pot black.

Anyway he always makes one think – and he does it with ascerbic wit.

Lay off Petofi please?

Btw, Petofi? Is Montreal to your liking? Or do you yearn to return to your homeland? Just curious!

Hungary needs you – you tell it like it is!

Guest

‘Montreal’ brought up a memory that I thought I’d share.
Back in the early 70’s a trip to Quebec that we thought initially would be fabulous turned out in reality to be a nightmare. Caught up in the ‘language’ war we didn’t have a chance as our ‘English’ mouths gave us away to get heaps of scorn and rudeness driven our way. A very bad trip was had by all. After what had happened no one would wonder then why I would go into boxing or for that matter to ever visit Quebec again.

But a recent trip back to Quebec showed how much had changed as we enjoyed the great historic city to the utmost far far from past experience. If we were in the ‘zeitgeist’ it was a good one.

So the takeaway is things can change. The waters move on. Every dog gets its day. And nothing lasts forever. Not even Fidesz or Jobbik.

petofi
Guest

Dear Professor Harnad,

re: ugly racist remarks

“Ugly”?
Why, are their ‘pretty’ racist remarks?

I suggest that you work for the kernel of truth in my over-the-top remarks. Yes, I use broad brush strokes but that’s just my sense of fun with a well nigh ridiculous, and quite hopeless, situation. As a once proud Hungarian, what is allowable is worthy of the angriest possible retort.

But I don’t mind you trying to right the good ship Petofi and putting him back on the rails (to mix my metaphors a touch).
Indeed, your several references to “ceterum senseo” has sent me scurrying to Wikipedia to find meaning and source–“it must be destroyed” (Cato’s continuous calls to destroy Carthage).

Since I’m throwing bouquets, one to Charlie, who has in one swell swoop remined me of a book a read some 50 years ago–Three Weeks To A Better Vocabulary.

oleaginous–oily or greasy

amanuensis–a literary or artistic assistant (In Kovacs’ case,
the accent would be on ‘fawning assistant’.

Thank you both!

Reality Check
Guest

So, Roma are good at “jive-ass dipsy-doodling” and Orban is even better? What exactly are you trying to say about Roma?

Jean P.
Guest

“I wonder what he would say if the European Union placed a full-page ad in a Hungarian newspaper urging people to vote against the anti-immigrant referendum he insists on holding.”

Nice thought but they wouldn’t print it.

pappp
Guest

There needs to be no consistency. The Russian example shows that the more confusing the situation is, with multiple state media saying opposite things the better is for the leader. Average people can’t possibly understand the situation (just as with the Matolcsy foundations most people don’t have a clue) and they tune out figuring at best that it’s controversial so some people say this, others say that, it’s not for them, it’s for the politicians. They will thus vote again along the usual lines of nationalism, pride, hate etc.

Guest

They will thus vote again along the usual lines of nationalism, pride, hate etc.

Only in Hungary – just look at the first comment, which will hopefully soon be deleted.

You must be really proud of Hungary/Hungarians?

paganini
Guest

Paks 2 is indeed sacrosanct. Orban decided to build it and he won’t give up. Corrupt German politicians in bed with Russians also help. No matter how disadvantageous Paks 2 is to Hungary it is, it is a top priority.

http://444.hu/2016/06/21/rejtelyes-budapesti-talalkozo-paks-megmenteseert

PALIKA
Guest
Eva, in the first place I repeat with renewed emphasis that you must take immediate steps to have this blog properly moderated. I believe that it is offensive and against the law in many of the countries from which it can be accessed that racist hate messages appear quite frequently. I was the victim of some last week and now you have been targeted. It is not in my view a matter for you whether the comment is acceptable to you. It is in my view your duty to act to stop its repetition . The next point is that OV has done nothing more or less than the President of the USA did when he delivered an admittedly heavy handed anti Brexit message to the UK voters on his last visit. It is clear to me that Hungary’s national interest would be harmed by Brexit. Hungary exports workers it cannot employ in the country. The weight that the message carries is alas minimal because OV is damaged goods in the EU. Unless I am very much mistaken you are a supporter of Brexit. I believe that if so you are profoundly mistaken. I lived in the UK before we… Read more »
Guest

Hungary exports workers it cannot employ in the country.

What kind of nonsense is this? It should read:

Hungary exports workers it cannot pay in the country …

Btw this blog is moderated – just not in the way you would like it – why don’t you go to some Fidesz site? There you’ll have your kind of moderation!

webber
Guest

Where do you get the idea that Eva supports Brexit?? I see no position from her on the issue, whatsoever.

Moderating the blog: Please drop it. You are full of nonsense.

PALIKA
Guest

I may be mistaken about Eva and Brexit. If so I apologise. The rest of what I wrote remains just as valid.

On anti semitic or other racist hate messages my views remain the same . The are both offensive and unlawful and it is the duty of those who run this blog to institute a proper system of moderation. If you read its terms and conditions these type of messages are contrary to those rules. We are bound by those terms mutually by accessing the blog. We are I believe entitled to require those who organise the blog to enforce their own rules.

It is not an answer that I should stop accessing it. The challenge of reading and exchanging views and comments is an enjoyable pass time. The racist abuse which clearly some of you enjoy is an intolerable obscenity and should be addressed by those who organise the blog. There is no entitlement for anyone to subject others in the course of their lawful pursuits to having to read it.

I simply do not understand what reason there can be for the organisers’ chronic failure to deal with it. Maybe I am missing something

webber
Guest

Why read the comments, if it bothers you so much?
You could just read Eva’s articles, and leave it at that.

Guest

webber?

I’d like Eva to moderate over-sensitive contributors on here who make unrealistic demands, as if it were their blog – without realising that they don’t have to read it.

Terminally moderate.

We used to have a campaigner in England called Mary Whitehouse who attempted to impose her ‘Christian’ values on our media and became a laughing stock – sometimes being sent up without realising it.

Her great crusade was trying to ‘clean-up’ television and she would begin with “I was watching television last Friday night and it was the biggest load of filth I have ever seen on television for a long time……..” without realising that there was an ‘off’ button.

This YouTube video gives you a flavour of those times where she is being interviewed in Australia. She sometimes worked in association with Cliff Richard – widely believed to be a repressed homosexual who is under a bit of a cloud for alleged criminal sexual practice with boys which he denys.

https://youtu.be/B5Dt12DjAWE

Posters who insist on setting the agenda – when it’s not their blog can start one of their own.

Thank God for Rubicon events like the ‘Lady Chatterley’s Lover’ trial that trounced these pious oversensitive bleaters.

And freedom if the media.

Begone. Begone. Begone.

webber
Guest

“I believe that it is offensive and against the law in many of the countries from which it can be accessed that racist hate messages appear quite frequently…”

Eva is obviously asleep. When she awakes, I am sure she will get rid of that awful comment – directed toward her. What more can she do? Nothing.

There are regularly personal attacks on her that she has to deal with.

As to the law, you are sadly misinformed. You thought some days ago that you, personally, could take legal action. You couldn’t have, as I pointed out.

PALIKA
Guest

Why do you argue? We agree it should not be there in the first place and would not have been if the blog was moderated. Ergo, get it moderated.

Guest

Maybe you would like to comment on what’s happening in Hungary – or aren’t you interested?

Read the article linked by our Finn Sentrooppa …

Or if you want “moderation” go to breitbart.com which had an article on Hungary recently and then tell us what you think about the comments there …

PALIKA
Guest

I have read the article and thank you. I am pretty well in touch with Hungarian events thanks inter alia to Eva’s dilligence. I share your concerns if not necessarily its percieved enormity. I prefer to add something when I can rather than fulminate in a chorus of indignation.

Racist abuse on other blogs is of no interest because my time is limited to following this one. I am afraid I do not see how a well balanced adult can object to moderating to remove the obscene racist abuse we keep seeing on this blog before we have to read them.

Jean P.
Guest

HS is well moderated as it is. I appreciate that my comment appears immediately after I have pushed the button. That would not be possible if Eva had to check every comment before it was let loose. In that case all comments made when she is sleeping or working would suffer delays. My motivation for writing a comment would be less if I knew that there was a backlog of unmoderated comments, and my thought might have been expressed already by somebody else. Dynamics would be lost.

The price of having a dynamic blog is that persons who enjoy to misuse the comment facility for personal attacks, obscenities or racial slur can have their weird satisfaction. It does not disturb me but I approve that the worst cases are removed when the block owner has time for it.

webber
Guest

“get it moderated”
Will you pay for that?
Eva is doing this gratis (did you not know that?) She can only cut comments after she sees them.

Member

What kind of “racist and hate” messages did you receive last week? I don’t recall anything of the sort. Even when going back, I cannot find any such messages.

Member

At the same time, British papers are writing about Orbán’s private choo-choo train and how and why European taxpayers paid 80% of this bizarre project, a mini railway transporting nobody from nowhere via nowhere to the middle of nowhere. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/19/hungarian-prime-minister-viktor-orban-investigated-over-2m-eu-fu/

Guest

London Calling!

“The stadium drew comparisons with a similar vanity project of the former Romanian despot Nikolai Ceausescu, and with crowds at the stadium often dipping below 1,000, is already seen as something of a white elephant.”

How often have we compared Orban with Ceausescu on here?

The accompanying picture of Orban is a hoot!

The Telegraph has found one that even beats Eva in her quest for suitable pictures!

The article is a very well informed write-up of Orban’s Choo-Choo train project – I’m sure it must have been informed by Eva’s blog.

Orban knows he is bomb-proof – idle threats from the EU will lead to nothing as usual.

I don’t usually read the Telegraph, so thanks for posting this Sentrooppa-Santra

******** Self-moderator Software Alert!!!!*******

This post has tripped some of the ‘moderator’ defaults and should be read with care

If you are of a nervous paranoid pious bleaty sort of disposition Do Not Read.

If there’s anything you don’t understand in the phrase ‘do not read’ we can arrange for a counsellor to assist you.

Software completed successfully.

If you have been affected in any way by this article you can phone 0800 808080 to speak to someone. Lines will be open until midnight.

Member

And we love to see how you demonstrate the intellectual level of extreme-rightwing trolls. That is, that of a 10-year-old schoolyard bully. Thank you for this interesting example of political argumentation à la hongroise.

bimbi
Guest

So Viktor Orban agrees with George Soros. High time. Mr. Soros, in comments quoted by the Guardian states that the Brexit crash will make all of you (the British) poorer. He urges “Remain”. Here is a voice that is worth listening to, unlike Orban who is once again doing his little peacock dance in an utterly inappropriate context but, of course, in Fidesz terms any international exposure for the Great Leader from the East (at tax-payers expense), is good exposure.

And as for Dr. Zsolt Semjen, the well-known academic plagiarist, his antics with the extreme right Spanish catholic bishop serve only to emphasize how out-of-touch and nutty the “christian” right is in Hungary. What cynical politicking from the power-hungry and money-grubbing Hungarian Catholic church and its hangers-on.

Guest

Yes, indeed.

We listen to Soros over here! (Without any conspiracy theory sentiment either!)

Whenever it is accompanied by Zoltan Kovács’ comments my instant ‘toadying’ liar detector flashes constantly with a fireworks of red warning lights!

He is so eager to please his master that truth is always the first victim.

Unfortunately he has very good English – with an annoying bass exaggeration like a ‘smooth’ DJ or an advert voice over. Oleaginous is the word I’m looking for!

I don’t know his background but I bet he is a descendant of the privileged communist families who were too eager to inform on their fellow Hungarians.

Foreign media can speedily get an ‘insta-quote’ so he is relatively over-exposed in our media.

I know from contacts in the BBC – as I’ve mentioned before – that they were told to lay off giving him exposure. And he told blatant lies on Channel 4 news over the migrants issue.

A thoroughly nasty amanuensis for Orban.

I have to reserve comment on the Unchristian Roman Catholic Church as without a moderator I may cause offence to our more sensitive brethren.

Sinn Fein
Guest

“We listen to Soros over here!”

Of course, how else would you know what to think and say? Does he send you stock tips at least?

Miklós Haraszti
Guest

Here is the explanation why Orbán opposes Brexit:
Brexit and New Europe​
Laszlo Bruszt and Nauro F. Campos
http://prosyn.org/TrCPrME

PALIKA
Guest

MiKilos, thanks for the interesting article.

Guest
Re: ‘Oddly, the EU might benefit from a setback. If the UK chooses to stay under the conditions Cameron has negotiated, the result will be the strengthening of the anti-EU alliance between conservative liberals and illiberal nationalists. As much as it would harm Europe in the short term, Brexit would have the benefit of preventing such a roadblock to integration from being erected.’ Considering Brexit, it is impossible to take into account all of the contingencies that can occur on the continent. And Messrs Kovacs and Lazar apparently speak like men having the ‘calm confidence of a Christian with four aces’ when they note they have the financials covered with a possible Brexit. No worries at all. But arguably in the event of a Brexit that turns real bad and disrupts the analysis made by the ‘oracles’ , the government will have a ready made target for their attack on the EU setup. It will afford a self-fulfilling prophecy that the EU is dysfunctional and delusional in its goals. And with that it shows what a sham apparently exists in the relationship CEE countries have with the EU. Brexit-No Brexit: Magyarorszag getting its cake … and always eating it too… Read more »
pappp
Guest
Dear Mr. Haraszti, this article, with all due respect, is loughably naive. I thought at least you are smarter than that. The writers starting point is pathologically rational and defetist. Nothing could be further from the truth when it comes to nationalist politics. Maybe it is time liberals review this extreme rationalist approach. Orban is not pro-EU/anti-Brexit, he – via us, the taxpayers – only paid for a few advertisements. Why would anybody with any knowledge about Orban deduce that he is anti-Brexit and/or pro-EU? His policy has been consistently and unabashedly anti-EU and anti-NATO (I can’t comment on his backchannel bullshitting, but this is what we know). What these “analysts” imply is the old argument, oh, he is really a good guy, you see, but he has to be more populist to win votes. No. With Orban what you see is what you get. He hates the EU and admires Russia. This advertisement thing was a media hack (and a minor one at that). He will continue to work against the EU, to try to divide it (belülről bomlasztani). In 2016 somebody still believes that Orban is someone who was persuaded, who came to believe that well, we anyway… Read more »
Guest

Pa pp, now you’re talking sense – at least about Mr Illiberal Anti-EU O!

I’m really surprised! 🙂

webber
Guest

I’m surprised too! Pleasantly, I must say.

Member

I may be wrong, but I would urge caution about Pppp’s ostensible bonification. “Play good-cop/bad-cop with multiple identities to divide and divert” is a cornerstone of the Putin playbook for troll malfare, from which Orban’s Pannonian Panzerkeil takes more than a page or two…

petofi
Guest

Thank you, Miklos.
A thought-provoking article. It puts me in mind of an interview with an aid worker in Africa some twenty years ago: he said, largely, that all aid is counter-productive. Africans will not improve their lot while they’re thrown aid their way. Being highly practical, Africans deem it idiotic to rid themselves of the very cause of long-term aid!

Tyrker
Guest

“The article tries to calm Hungarian nerves by emphasizing that Great Britain’s exit wouldn’t have any serious consequences for Hungary and that those approximately 200,000 Hungarians living in Great Britain have nothing to fear”

Wonder where they got that figure from. The official British estimates put the number of Hungarian-born UK residents at 79,000 (+/- 12,000) which is, incidentally, one-tenth the number of Poles living in the country.

Guest

I’m sure the official figures don’t include many Hungarians who on paper still live in Hungary but only return every few months …

So Tyrker is again (as he is wont to do …) telling us a half truth!

webber
Guest

Tyrker’s name means “Turks” in Danish. An odd choice.

Guest

You know all this stuff about names here makes me think I’m watching that great film ‘The Third Man’ where names get messed up. Some like Martins aren’t getting anything straight in trying to find out what happened to ‘Harry’ especially with names where a ‘Calloway’ is a ‘Callahan’ and getting the deadpan retort, ‘I’m English not Irish!’ ‘Popescu’ is ‘Popesco’ and ‘Winkel’ is ‘Vinkel!’ Names , they sure can make the quest for ‘truths’ confusing…;-)…

petofi
Guest

In a BBC piece on Rolls Royce, Poles were heading three of the manufacturing arms of the great company (one, I think, was the leather section). Needless to say, there we no Hungarians in similarly respected posts…

And, by the way, some years ago when I was in Dublin, I discovered that Polish workers were highly respected. In fact, the Wednesday Dublin daily had an insert of 4 pages, all in Polish.

(Need I say that Hungarians are not equally valued…?)

PALIKA
Guest

Petofi, you are right. Poles have been much respected in the UK for many decades going back to WW2. When I first came to London they brought a welcome colour to the town by running grocers shops where the merchandise was rather more exciting for Central Europeans like me than the stuff the Brits liked. More recently the Polish shops are still a great addition to our lives. Most Supermarkets have Polish sections. They also feature in other walks of life, as you say.
Hungarians have fewer shops and they are best avoided by the health conscious. Those businesses as well as those in the building and other trades are run by decent hardworking people who do not have it easy in a foreign land. Hungarians are not like Poles, they are like Hungarians. Where I meet them Hungarians are much valued. Why do you feel the need to denigrate decent, hardworking folk for being Hungarian?

Guest

Poles have been much respected in the UK for many decades going back to WW2.
Well, they were victims of Hitler’s and Stalin’s aggression – while Hungary was a willing ally of Hitler even helping with the invasion of Russia …

Seems many (not all of course …) Hungarians like to be aggressive – and then they often choose the losing side. Is that a kind of tradition, or a Hungaricum?

PALIKA
Guest

People in the UK have no recollection of the very anctient past.

Hungarians are doing OK in the UK. Let them be, please.

petofi
Guest

Because ‘decent, hardworking folk’ would be shamed from the top of their heads to their very shoe bottoms…to see the reactionary developments in Hungary. And all these ‘decent’ folk just take it in and carry on…”Doesn’t bother me personally, so why should I bother?” That’s the typical Hungarians view. Phooey to that!

Sinn Fein
Guest

Based on your comments I doubt you or wolfi ever had a single “decent” or “hardworking” person in your family tree so you seem to be unqualified to talk about the subject. Every Hungarian, Slovak or Pole I’ve met have been ok – some a bit too drunk but they usually sober up. Leftist “antifascists” types OTOH are usually aholes and nuts – whether drunk or sober.

Sinn Fein
Guest

He feels the need to denigrate Hungarians because that is the theme of this blog – racism (veiled as a critique of politics). A Hungarian probably stole his caviar sandwich in school and he never forgot about it (no doubt with caviar that his daddy party boss got from his KGB contacts in Odessa). Most of the regular posters are “dwellers” so to say.

They even have a favourite word they repeat mindlessly:

troll, troll, troll

Observer
Guest

Yes, troll, and a silly one as well.

Sinn Fein
Guest

See, there is another one – another mental flatliner

Tyrker
Guest
Sinn Fein
Guest

Orban has to decide what he wants. If he wants the end of the EU (as I think he should) then he should plan for it and accordingly. He seems to want to be half-pregnant.

I bet Soros is ready to buy up pounds as soon as he drives the sterling just a little bit lower with his comments – that’s the way the 1% make their money.

Observer
Guest

Fidesznik lies again?
The article says Soros favors single currency and integration, exactly the opposite to Organ.

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