Hungarian reaction to Donald Trump’s victory

What else can one write about today except the totally unexpected victory of Donald Trump in the U.S. presidential election? Half of the United States might be in shock that the next president of the United States will be someone of questionable character and temperament who has absolutely no governing experience, but that will not change the fact that in less than three months Donald Trump will be moving into the White House.

Naturally Hungarian papers led with the story of Trump’s “revolution,” as a Hungarian commentator called his landslide victory in the electoral college, especially since Prime Minister Viktor Orbán was one of the very few international politicians looking forward to a Trump presidency.

Before I get to Hungarian reactions to Trump’s victory, let me go back a week, to a poll conducted by the Závecz Research Institute released on October 2, according to which only 10% of Hungarians were rooting for a Trump victory. Reflecting their unfamiliarity with American politics, about a third of the respondents had no opinion. In Hungary there was no disparity between female and male voters in their attitudes toward the candidates. Because of Viktor Orbán’s announcement of his preference for Trump, among his followers support for Trump was the highest, at 23%, but 47% of Fidesz supporters still preferred Clinton. Among Jobbik voters it was even higher, 54%. The most enthusiastic Clinton fans could be found among DK voters, at 93%. Once these poll results were released, Index published this funny picture. So, you can imagine the shock today.

Well, it didn't quite work out

Well, it didn’t quite work out this way

After the announcement of Trump’s victory, politicians all over the world began sending him congratulations. Viktor Orbán was perhaps the first European politician to congratulate Trump on his Facebook page. Whoever wrote the brief English congratulatory note got a bit confused about the grammatical rules of the English language, but what came afterward was really funny. Hungarian trolls passed themselves off as American nationals who in broken English sang the praises of the two great leaders and protectors of the world, Orbán and Trump. Magyar Idők fell for the ruse before the administrator of Orbán’s Facebook page removed the comments.

Later in the day Orbán had an opportunity to elaborate on his assessment of Trump’s victory, which he attributed to the fact that “democracy is still alive.” A few hours later, this time already in London on a brief visit to Prime Minister Theresa May, he told journalists that it was always beneficial to the world when it could free itself from the prison of prevailing ideological trends and could return to reality. Naturally, he was talking about liberalism and its value system.

The other Fidesz politician who commented on the presidential election and its possible consequences for Hungary was Zsolt Németh, Fidesz chairman of the Parliamentary Committee on Foreign Affairs and the vice president of the Hungarian Atlantic Council. He is a man who supposedly would like to restore good relations with the United States. In an interview he gave to 888.hu, he told the reporter that with the victory of Trump he “expects a much more active U.S. policy relating to the security of the world.” He blamed the U.S. State Department for the lack of dialogue between the two countries. He also expressed his hope that in a Trump administration “the United States will give up its export of democracy and its interventionist policies. He reassured the readers of 888.hu that it was foolish to worry about the future of NATO under Trump. I have no idea on what basis Németh arrived at these pronouncements. So far Trump has shown scant interest in international security issues.

Index said that the democratic opposition’s leading lights were “benumbed,” that they still hadn’t recovered from their shock. Gyula Molnár of MSZP simply wrote: “The American people decided. They elected Trump as their future president. This decision must be respected.” LMP’s message was equally terse: “LMP respects the decision of the American people and congratulates Donald Trump on his electoral success.”

Ferenc Gyurcsány was much more expansive and friendly. “Congratulations to Donald Trump, the new president of the United States. He was the one who captured the imagination of the majority of Americans. There’s no reason to panic. The United States is still a country of freedom and democracy, and it is in the interest of the world that it remains so. I don’t think that the troubled relations between Obama and Orbán substantially weakened the Hungarian government or strengthened its opposition. And the opposite state of affairs will not happen under Trump. Orbán must be beaten at home. We can’t expect assistance from Washington. What we can learn from the U.S. elections is that one can overcome the lack of media and funding. Moreover, pollsters are not infallible. From tomorrow on, we will focus on the tasks ahead and the replacement of the Orbán government.”

Pro-Fidesz papers also weighed in on the U.S. election. According to one of 888.hu’s young journalists, László Bertha, “the victory of Trump may be the beginning of the end, not of democracy, but of the monopoly of liberal opinion.” On the pro-Fidesz but extreme right-wing site Demokrata, László Szentesi-Zöldi began: “Let’s take a deep breath and declare that Viktor Orbán is not lucky but is a genius who can look into the future. Regardless of what kind of president Trump will be, it is already engraved for posterity that only three heads of government in the whole world supported Trump in advance of the election. One of them was Viktor Orbán. This fact will have incalculably beneficial consequences for Hungarian-American relations.” Szentesi-Zöldi hopes that Trump will put an end to Obama’s “cold war” and will move closer to Russia. The prospects in Hungary are bright. “Bell will soon be packing and the new boss will dispense with the services of György Bolgár and his [liberal] ilk.”

Perhaps the most surprising editorial was written by Zsolt Jeszenszky, son of Géza Jeszenszky, foreign minister between 1990 and 1994 who also served as Hungarian ambassador in Washington during the first Orbán administration. As far as I can ascertain, Zsolt Jeszenszky engages in political analysis as a hobby. Otherwise, he is the music director of Lánchíd Rádió, part of Lajos Simicska’s formerly influential, pro-government media holdings. His article titled “America, I Love You!” appeared on the conservative news site mandiner.hu. He explains the reasons for Trump’s spectacular performance this way. “Many people had had enough of constantly being called stupid and racist and being lectured at because the liberal elite wants to prescribe what to think, believing liberalism to be the depository of unquestionable truth.” This stigmatized group went out and voted. Not because they are homophobes, racists, or xenophobic. But because the elite “tries to force its own opinions, affairs, slogans, and goals on ordinary people who are not interested in world peace, the blessings of multiculturalism, gay rights, or female and other kinds of quotas.”

The pro-government commentators found their man in Trump, who in many ways resembles their own idol, a man who tells it as it is. I’m not surprised at their genuine admiration of the man. What especially appeals to them is that he won against all odds. “If for nothing else, for this reason he deserves our trust.” I for one find the connection between trust and the difficulty of the road to victory more than tenuous.

November 9, 2016
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Zoli
Guest

Bottom line? Hungary can breathe as sigh of relief. No Nuland mission to bring cookies and “democracy” to Hungary, at least for the rest of the decade. I also think that the entire ME-EU region has reason to be reassured (the people, not the elite). The fact that regime-change Hillary did not win gives the region a chance to recover from the damage done.

HPI
Guest

The Balogh Blog is not paying attention to the Russian plots.
Hungary is again the old satellite state.
The Orban regime is a tool for Moscow.
The regime’s task is to weaponize/destabilize Hungary to create problems for the West.

HPI
Guest

Most of you are armchair observers.
I live in USA, and communicate with hardcore democrats.
These people are the kings and queens of hate.
Their mind has been filled with Vietnam era disinformation.
Eva, Charles Gati and Stevan Hernad should reject the bottom layers of these Democrats, the friends of Noam Chomsky, Phyllis Bennis, Chris Hedges, etc.
They sank the Hillary boat.
The sweet deplorables staged a coup against the hate section of the Democrats.
The decent Democrats have not deserved this punishment.

Member

“Recover” means restoring the dictatorships, right?

Zoli
Guest

@Mutt: Given that Libya and Syria are now failed states, with perhaps 500,000 dead or more, restoring dictatorship seems like a step up, don’t you think? Or do you really believe that the average Syrian is now glad that their country has become another Somalia, with most infrastructure and institutions completely obliterated?

BTW, by “recover” I meant healing the wounds of the upheaval unleashed by that rabid zealot, which is now being felt throughout the Muslim world and Europe. Perhaps for a globalist-anarchist upheaval is a welcome development, but I think most people would like a return to normal.

Member

“to recover from the damage done.”

When will Hungary recover from the damage ORBAN has done?

destroyed education, health care, labor & environment protection,

stolen hundreds of billions from the public
net government debt is up by 50%+ in forints

silenced or choked opposition media,
partizan courts, prosecutors, public television & radios

abolished constitution
distorted & potentially fraudulent new election system.

Guest

— When will Hungary recover from the damage ORBAN has done?

In today’s ever faster changing world? Never I am afraid.

Member

Jeszenszky just repeated things he read somewhere, but he’s got a point. You can already sense it in the FB comments. Some people are praising Trump’s victory as the end of the political correctness era. This recipe worked for Orban when he basically liberated anti-semites, racists, homophobes from the guilt.

Apropos. The last Trump TV ad was basically an anti-semite pamphlet. The Orbanites will love it. Trump may not have told us everything about his views.

Trump very likely will not care about Hungary unless he finds another expensive Eastern European escort to marry for the fourth time. I would love to see a Timi Vajna giving a speech.

ronald
Guest

If the commentator Zsolt Jeszensky understood the base of Trump’s voters he would recognize that they are homophobes, racist and xenophobic. How else do you explain that they were either white male older uneducated working class or white southern racist electorate who want the old South to be again as it was so American can be great again: they shortly are to be the minority that they are becoming as the US becomes global and diverse. Our jobs that they seek will never return – the work is done by computers today or by the third world countries. Americans can also be misogynists vote against their own interests – how else can you explain support by the working class for a candidate who is dropping the tax rate for the top 1% and cutting the opportunity for health insurance and food assistance for those who can least afford it.

Tyrker
Guest

You sound like you haven’t read this piece yet: http://www.cracked.com/blog/6-reasons-trumps-rise-that-no-one-talks-about/

Guest

Re: ‘Our jobs that they seek will never return – the work is done by computers today or by the third world countries’

No doubt. And the thing is if Trump doesn’t ‘get’ it like ‘Tanacs Viktor’ when it comes to education (and the lack of it) and its effect on the country’s well-being for the future he’s going to have one hell of a part of a raging and marginalized electorate to deal with if he doesn’t come through. If he’s got ideas they better be good and actionable.

Joe Simon
Guest

The number of Americans contacting realtors in Canada went up dramatically. I wonder if any of you at HS would want to settle here in Canada. How can you preach the Gospel from what is by all accounts a Super Jobbik country.
It is almost like preaching morality from a brothel.

webber
Guest

Why do you live there? How can you? You obviously fully approve of the brothel that Orban’s regime is running.

Charles Gati
Guest

Please note that (a) Trump did not have anything approaching an overwhelming victory in the Electoral College, and that (b) a slight majority of Americans voting actually preferred Clinton. Trump does have a mandate, but it is a limited one.

Member

If Trump and the Republican leaders in Congress agree in a bill, the only limit will be conscience.

Will they introduce a flat income tax, with no more personal exemption and standard deduction? [Orban obviously got the same idea in 2010 from US Republican advisors.]

Member

(b) Indeed, the popular votes went to

2000. Gore: 48.4% (51.0 million), Bush Jr: 47.9% (50.5 million)
2016. Clinton: 47.7% (59.9 million), Trump: 47.5% (59.7 million)

Member

Popular votes of the winning presidential candidate:

1940. Roosevelt 54.7% (27.3 million)
1944. Roosevelt 53.4% (25.6 million)
1948. Truman 49.6% (24.1 million) !
1952. Eisenhower 54.9% (33.8 million)
1956. Eisenhower 57.4% (35.6 million)
1960. Kennedy 49.7% (34.2 million) !
1964. Johnson 61.1% (42.8 million)
1968. Nixon 43.4% (31.7 million) !
1972. Nixon 60.2% (46.7 million)
1976. Carter 50.0% (40.8 million)

Member

1980. Reagan 50.5% (43.6 million)
1984. Reagan 58.8% (54.5 million)
1988. Bush Sr 53.4% (48.9 million)
1992. Clinton 43.0% (44.9 million) ! [Perot]
1996. Clinton 49.2% (47.4 million) !
2000. Bush Jr 47.9% (50.5 million) !!
2004. Bush Jr 50.7% (62.0 million)
2008 Obama 52.9% (69.5 million)
2012 Obama 51.1% (65.9 million)
2016 Trump 47.5% (59.7 million) !!

Member

% of votes in the Electoral College since 1920.

2000. Bush Jr: 50.37%
2004. Bush Jr: 53.16%
1976. Carter: 55.20%
1968. Nixon: 55.95%
1960. Kennedy: 56.42%

2016. Trump: 56.88% [NH to Clinton, MI to Trump]
1948. Truman: 57.06%
2012. Obama: 61.71%
2008. Obama: 67.84%
1992. Clinton: 68.77%
1996. Clinton: 70.45%
[…]
1972. Nixon: 96.65%
1984. Reagan: 97.58%
1936. Roosevelt: 98.49%

gdfxx
Guest

Trump received 279 electoral votes vs. Clinton’s 228. This is 56.7% of the electoral votes, not overwhelming but quite a victory, considering that Clinton’s victory was considered a fait accompli by most “experts”. The majority of voters is an interesting fact but it is insignificant in view of how the US Constitution defines presidential elections. By the way, Obama received 61.7% of the electoral votes in 2012, only 5% more than Trump.

Reviewing the reactions in Hungary, Gyurcsany’s words seem to be the most rational to me.

Member

Wrong.

Trump: 279+Arizona+16 (Michigan) + 11 (Arizona) = 306
Clinton: 228+ 4 (New Hampshire) = 232

A Democratic elector from Washington state declared before election day that he would never vote fro Hillary,

so the likely result of the actual electoral vote “on the Monday after the second Wednesday in December” (December 19 in 2016) will be:

Trump 306, Clinton: 231

aida
Guest

Professor, whether the guy has a big or a limited mandate is of small real impact. There have been a number of examples in the past where a President is elected on a minority of the popular vote. At no time has there been any attempt that I can remember to change the electoral system to prevent repetition. I would suggest that the voters accept that this is a fair system.
I wait to see how Trump behaves in office, but I am not so pessimistic. He is however unlikely to spend much time placating the Metropolitan liberals, to begin with at least.

Member

“The pro-government commentators found their man in Trump, who in many ways resembles their own idol,”

The big difference is that Trump made his billions in $’s as a businessman BEFORE becoming a politician – like Gyurcsany [!!], while Orban made his billions in HUF’s as a dictator – like Khadafi.

Member

I am not sure whether it’s true or just urban scuttlebut, but one can read that if Trump had just put his father’s initial start-up millions into conservative investments and left them alone (instead of dabbling in real estate and other misadventures), he’d have a lot more money than he has today. So he did not make billions; he lost them. His only asset is his start-up dosh. Certainly no mental assets there except the usual psychopath’s lack of scruple. That he shares with Orban.

The yahoos who voted for him as a role model for (personal or national) “wealth creation” are as deluded (and petty) as the changelings who imagined that he would right the wrongs they are convinced have been malignly inflicted on them by “the elite” (whom I’m not defending here from anything but conspiratorial rancor).

http://fortune.com/2015/08/20/donald-trump-index-funds/
http://www.moneytalksnews.com/why-youre-probably-better-investing-than-donald-trump/
https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2015-09-03/should-donald-trump-have-indexed-
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gdfxx
Guest

I heard this argument before. The fact is that many people lose their money when they invest it, even when doing it conservatively.

Trump did not lose his money, he made less than others may have made with the same starting capital. But he still made billions, something that most people in the world do not achieve.

Member

The Genius of the Karpathian Basement (and his soul-mate of the Drumfian Summit)

Orban’s putative political gifts are as much a myth as Trump’s imaginary financial skills.

(No one is as useless with money as I am, but if someone dropped the equivalent of Trump’s $200M (today $500M) start-up dosh in my lap, I’m sure I could do at least as well with it as he did — if it weren’t for the fact that I’d immediately put it to a different use.)

(Someone should write about the decent use of power the equivalent of Peter Singer’s book on the decent use of money.)

Daniel
Guest

The fact Hillary could have been more “interventionist” in Hungarian matters, should not sway the oppositions: Gyurcsany is right. Only Hungarians can remove Orban. And perhaps, a president less prone to export democracy, will not make a mess like in the last 15years.

Guest

“Only Hungarians can remove Orban.”

Ideally, yes, but how about the historical record?

Was Vercingetorix removed by the Celts? Was Salvador Allende removed by the Chileans? Was Imre Nagy removed by the Hungarians?

Guest

Speaking of the Gaul, the opp could use a rebel like him. And throw in the German Arminius as well. They were ‘influencers’ in getting their populations to say ‘no!’. Some hate to get pushed around. They demanded to be listened to.

Member

“…Lánchíd Rádió, part of Lajos Simicska’s formerly influential, pro-government media holdings…”

Should have read “formerly influential, formerly pro-government media holdings” — no-one in the government is permitted to talk to anybody in the group, or even stock the Magyar Nemzet.

Guest

Donald Trump’s statement on banning Muslims from US has disappeared from his website.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/donald-trump-president-election-muslim-ban-immigrants-website-statement-removed-a7408466.html

Will Orban take the message?

Member

Just the way around: Trump would like to copy Orban and wants to sell his, BIGGER tower to Pharaon. 🙂

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Member

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Guest

A contrast of architectural styles. And also one of psychologies. The Parthenon’s grandeur exists as a benefit and gift for all mankind. It is a building of marble containing a story exemplifying the best and high-mindedness of the society that produced it. The shiny sleek black and windowed edifice in contrast speaks to another rationale. It is one man’s myopic vision towards the gods of money and power. The exceedingly smooth lines show nothing but windows erected by rote to get to an apex. A building devoid of life and soul. It does rise high yet it ‘touches’ nothing.

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giuseppe
Guest

a big problem for the west is that the democratic centre-left parties tend to represent bureucracies andare too much interested in banks and financial interests .
Some of what they call “populist” parties are just a reaction to that.
As for Obama …he made big mistakes in Lybia,Syriaand even succeded in restartin sort of cold war in Europe.

Member

Biggest contributor to Trump:
Renaissance Technologies, an investment management firm , $15,510,800
Second biggest contributor to Hillary:
Renaissance Technologies, an investment management firm ,
$14,034,550

They hedged their bets, didn’t they ?

Soros was only the fourth most generous contributor to Hillary, with $10,553,418, but he was principled, did not give a penny to Trump.

Donald Trump
Total raised: $306,930,980

Hillary Clinton:
Total raised: $687,261,894

Member

“Outside” spending, “independent” expenditures.
[In theory, they cannot coordinate with candidates or parties.]

for Trump:
“Get Our Jobs Back” : $50,010,166
Great America PAC: $24,527,532
NRA Institute for Legislative Action: $8,740,908

against Clinton:
Future45: $23,847,519
45 Committee: $18,115,330
Rebuilding America Now: $14,914,456
NRA Institute for Legislative Action: $12,250,243
National Rifle Assn: $7,447,455

for Clinton:
League of Conservation Voters: $6,278,915
Priorities USA Action: $6,030,293
Women Vote!: $5,389,341

against Trump:
Priorities USA Action: $125,351,295
Our Principles PAC: $16,353,117

Ferenc
Guest

in USA: with 47.7% against 47.5% of votes you may not become president and your party have minority in both houses of democracy
in Hungary: with 45% of votes 133 of 199 seats (66.8%) can be achieved
Both cases can be given as clear examples of questionable democratic rules, i.e.(not) each vote stand for equal representation and power.

Ferenc
Guest

Regarding Trump winning presidency, and looking around for “similar” populistic developments, it can be said that there is a lot of people feel a lot of “underbelly” anger. But that is anger new now, it was less, if even zero, before?
Well I don’t buy that, I think that anger didn’t change much, so what do they all have in common?
One major thing is I think the availability of internet in all it’s appearances (from scientific articles to one line twitters). Internet gives access to more information and more ways for expression. As each persons time is limitted to 24hr per day, it means that there are two ways to deal with this. One being that in going deeper into cases (like this blog) one needs to limit the cases, the other being going into more cases (like twitter) one needs to, in each case, limit the information.
So could “the internet” be an explanation for increasing “popularism”?
Looking forward for replies and interested in opinions from specialists in mass-psychology.

Ferenc
Guest

Trump, a real estate typhoon, was mostly known as a host of a popular reality show. Handing over the presidency of the USA to such a person, well I have my strong reservations.
Seems to me like asking Einstein to work as a carpenter for 4 years, I deeply wonder if in those 4 years anything more to be achived for mankind than some wacky woodconstructions and a serious amount of sore thumbs.

Guest

That ‘real estate typhoon’ sure blew up a storm in the US political arena, eh? But I think if he wants to leave something of a legacy he’ll have to tone down the blow- hard side of him. And we should be thankful for our viable ‘checks and balances’ system. It hasn’t gotten out of whack as in Magyarorszag where Viktor acts like a free ranging chicken. It’ll keep the ‘Queens’ boy honest.

Guest

“Seems to me like asking Einstein to work as a carpenter for 4 years. . .”

Do you think that Trump is on the level of Einstein while the skills of a good carpenter suffice to manage the US?

Is Trump a typhoon?

Ferenc
Guest

OK, sorry typhoon should read tycoon…….
Best answer your first question with this: Do you consider Einstein fit for being a carpenter? And what about Trump fit for president?

Guest

I did not bring up the Einstein comparison. You did and I asked you to explain it. Your counterquestion is not an answer.

Ferenc
Guest

My comparison is not Trump – Einstein, but:
Einstein as (unfit) carpenter resulting in……….
against
Trump as (unfit) president resulting in …………. (let’s hope not the worst)
So Trump way way way under the intellengency level of Einstein.
PS: if Trumps stays to carpenter’s work only during his time in the White House nothing seriously bad will happen.

Istvan
Guest
I think our president elect Trump will operate as if he has a vast mandate regardless of the popular vote Professor Gati. What we have in terms of national heath care, the Affordable Care Act, will be eliminated rapidly. As a Republican I and many others have supported numerous radical changes to the law, but not simple elimination as will shortly happen. Republicans in Congress began to lay serious groundwork for repeal of Obamacare last winter. In January, both the Senate and the House passed a reconciliation bill that took apart Obamacare’s expansion of Medicaid and private, subsidized health insurance. The bill didn’t matter much at the time and Obama vetoed it when it arrived at his desk — but it showed that Republicans could use the reconciliation process to take apart key Obamacare pillars, requiring a simple majority rather than the 60 votes needed to overcome a filibuster. The replacement will be some type of sponsored self insurance plan and that will come later if at all. Under what is called the National Command Authority a Trump administration can use nuclear weapons against IS held Raqqa without any Congressional debate, the only check on a launch would be Trump’s… Read more »
Member

The allied Kurdish forces are only 20 kilometers from Raqqa.
I do not think they [or the 100,000+ civilians] would like to be exposed to radiation.

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The problem is not to capture Raqqa or Mosul, but to capture the hearts of 1 billion+ Muslims, who think that Allah ordered them to wage wars 8 months a year. “When the sacred months are over, slay the idolaters wherever you find them. Arrest them, besiege them, and lie in ambush everywhere for them. ” (the chronologically penultimate, therefore TRUMP sura 9)

Istvan
Guest

No problem at all tappanch the Kurds would be more than happy not to die in door to door fighting, they can pull back to a ring of 40 to 60 k once advised to do so. Some tactical nuclear weapons have specific features meant to enhance their battlefield characteristics, such as variable yield which allow their explosive power to be varied over a wide range for different situations, or enhanced radiation weapons (the so-called “neutron bombs”) which are meant to maximize ionizing radiation exposure while minimizing blast effects.

The US military can now set the blast radius of tactical nuclear bombs. This is not a problem for the Kurds, it is a terrible problem for the people being held hostage by IS. It is a terrible problem in terms of morality too. But president elect Trump discussed this possibility none the less. The fact that our new commander and chief has discussed this possibility is pretty unnerving to me.

Guest

I can’t even start to imagine how many suicide bombers that US action would produce!

It would mean the end of peace (if not the end of the world …) for the USA, I’m sure – and maybe for us in Europe too.

Don’t these people ever consider the “unintended consequences” of their actions?
Still shuddering when thinking about the expression “collateral damage”!

If there were a hell and a god, I’m sure Bush and his advisors would have to spend an eternity in there …

Member

True story. Military exercise in the Bakony.

Officer points at a map and says:
“If the American troops reach this point, we simply drop an atomic bomb on them.”
Somebody raises his hands:
“But what happens to the local population?”
“Don’t ask questions.”

Guest

Seems like ‘pushing the limits’ which was a kind of the zeitgeist in Janos K’s era has made a rousing comeback.

aida
Guest

Mandate. like consensus are difficult to define and even more difficult to measure.

Member

Everybody, cheer up. The Simpsons predicted already in 2000 that the first “straight” female president (Lisa Simpson) will succeed president Trump.

“Lisa: As you know, we’ve inherited quite a budget crunch
from President Trump. How bad is it Secretary Van
Houten?
Milhouse: [shows to a chart] We’re broke.
Lisa: The country is broke? How can that be?”

Bart to the Future ,
Written by Dan Greaney
Original Airdate on FOX: 19-Mar-2000
http://www.simpsonsarchive.com/episodes/BABF13.txt

watch from 1:47 to 2:58

Istvan
Guest

Unfortunately it did not work, thanks for effort.

Member

Try this workaround:
Right click, copy video URL,
In another browser window: control V
Enjoy

Member

“https://youtu.be/lxjM1yCcqTQ?t=107”

Member

10 Times The Simpsons Predicted The Future

“https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G02rYAXtJHY”

Istvan
Guest

No I meant unfortunately it did not cheer me up. When you actually know real Trump voters this all gets more unnerving.

Ferenc
Guest

Ok, they got their first prediction right: Trump as president.
Curious for the other two (country broke and after Trump the first female president).
Wonder when in the “EU free” UK bets can be placed for this.

Guest

I’m really angry – not at Trump but at the dems and their supporters!

From tappanch’s numbers (thanks again!) and others like here it’s obvious:
http://www.spiegel.de/politik/ausland/ergebnis-us-wahl-2016-hillary-clinton-konnte-waehler-nicht-mobilisieren-a-1120670.html

Around 60 million votes for Hillary – compared to 70 million votes for Obama in 2008 (around 66 in 2012) !

The number of rep votes interestingly is about the same (60 million) in the last three election – even though the number of people allowed to vote must be higher now.

So where were these people who didn’t vote and why did they decide that it wasn’t worth their while going to the polling station?

People are lazy, stupid or really crazy it seems!

aida
Guest

Or, as so many others they neither liked nor trusted the dem candidate. She and her husband have made their political stand out of championing the poor and those left behind for reasons inter alia of race. When they left the White House at the end of Bil’s second term she said they were broke. During the next 16 years they became super rich, but not known for their generosity to the poor. The charity they set up is under suspicion that virtually none of its income goes to the objects. Yet it is said to have financed Chelsea’s wedding. No one could have persuaded me to vote for her, although I am on their side of politics. I am not angry. I am sad that the Clintons were able to kill off Bernie’s selection.

Guest

There was a great deal of voter suppression in areas that were pro-Democratic. I understand that over 600 polling places were closed. Early voting was cut back. People were unable to take enough time off from work to stand in long lines. In the coming days we may find out how many ‘lost’ votes there were.

Member

Which state had voter suppression ? What counts is Florida, Pennsylvania, Wisconsin and Michigan. None of these states are in the Deep South, where voter intimidation was rampant between 1877 and 1968 {Florida is half Northern}. I have not read of any suppression.

Yesterday I quoted the Florida results here.
Let us look them up again.

2016-11-10 4:40 PM [2016-11-09 3:20 PM]

Voted Vote-by-Mail : 2.729 [2.649] million
Voted early: 3.875 [3.875] million
Voted on November 8: 2.787 [2.863]

Trump: 4.607 [4.606]
Clinton: 4.488 [4.486]

Total ballots: 9.391 [9.387]

{I can see the discrepancy between the data}

http://enight.elections.myflorida.com/FederalOffices/Presidential/
http://www.nytimes.com/elections/results/florida

So only 29.7% [30.5%] of the votes were cast in person on election day.

Guest

Yes, Florida was the biggest disappointment – what happened there?

I’ve been there often on holiday and sometimes I thought I was in a Spanish district. So were did the Hispanic votes go?

Totally OT (or not?):
Friends of mine some years ago wanted to go to Florida on holiday – but their English is very limited. But they have a holiday home in Spain and speak Spanish very well so I told them they’d have no problem there – just speak Spanish.

And when they came back they reported how nicely they had been treated …

Member

Florida has always been split in the middle.
Remember the hanging chads of 2000 ?

comment image

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Florida_election_recount

Member

Orange county, California shows the increasing geographical polarization of the US. Orange county voted consistently for Republican presidential candidates in the last 80 years.

Now in 2016, when the Democrats turned out in much lower numbers than in 2008 or 2012, Hillary Clinton won Orange county. (It was Roosevelt in 1936 who managed to carry the county last time)

Total Registered Voters 1,535,967
Total Ballots Cast 826,582 53.8%

Precinct Ballots Cast 389,948 25.4%
Early Ballots Cast 5,596 0.4%
Vote-by-Mail Ballots Cast 431,038 28.1%

Clinton 49.8%
Trump 44.8%

https://www.ocvote.com/fileadmin/live/gen2016/results.htm

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