The Hungarian opposition is still in disarray

I am returning to party politics today because, after an extended holiday season, opposition politicians and civilians active in politics have become vocal again. One after the other gives interviews to newspapers or to the two friendly television stations, ATV and Hír TV. Naturally, the topic is how best to prepare for the 2018 national election. Alas, every time such a tsunami of statements comes from the opposition parties, confusion and discord reign.

While the opposition parties MSZP, DK, and Párbeszéd are allegedly negotiating and those negotiations are, according to reports, going well, one of MSZP’s big guns, István Hiller, at least according to Magyar Idők, announced on December 27 in an interview that he doesn’t believe in the kind of political partnership among the democratic parties that proved to be singularly unsuccessful in 2014. If it depends on him, such a strategy will never be repeated. I must say that this was a surprising announcement since Hiller’s party is currently negotiating with the small parties on the left.

That’s not the only subject on which MSZP leaders disagree. Unnamed MSZP sources told Magyar Hírlap a couple of days ago that the leadership is also divided over László Botka’s offering himself as a candidate for the premiership. They are puzzled by the fact that Botka twice sent messages to his own party, once via 168 Óra and again only two days ago in an interview given to Index, that were actually ultimatums. Moreover, some of Botka’s demands can’t be met. For example, the exclusion of Ferenc Gyurcsány from the election process, which even in the opinion of Gergely Karácsony of Párbeszéd is an impossibility.

Even though MSZP leaders are still optimistic that the parties will be able to agree on a common platform, there are a couple of hurdles that might make agreement difficult. One is the question of the selection process of the most promising candidates for each of the 106 individual electoral districts. The idea of primaries has been bandied about for years, but by the fall of 2016 Párbeszéd decided that this was the most promising way to find the best candidate in each district. This small party was then joined by civic groups, which kept widening the nominating process to the point that it now includes the possibility of voting online. For this they hired the company Anonim Digitális Azonosító (Anonymous Digital Identifier), whose website is already available. Párbeszéd managed to convince MSZP of the efficacy of primaries and DK, although not terribly enthusiastic, agreed to the idea if all the others are game. When it comes to the internet application, however, the other partners are less than keen. Moreover, Botka’s announcement that he finds primaries superfluous further complicates the situation since at the moment MSZP is still a supporter of the idea. Botka stressed the necessity of “choosing the best candidate” in each district but didn’t give any guidance as to how this should be accomplished.

The other possible stumbling block is the question of having a common party list versus having individual ones. One must keep in mind that in the Hungarian system each voter casts two votes, one for an individual and the other for a party. Two of the three parties that are still talking to one another are committed to a common list while DK is sitting on the fence, at least according to Népszava. I personally prefer one common list because separate party lists send a strong signal to the voters that unity is still sadly lacking.

You may have noticed that I didn’t mention Együtt and LMP. Despite hopes that with the departure of András Schiffer LMP’s new leadership would be more willing to cooperate with the other parties, this didn’t turn out to be the case. A couple of weeks ago I still felt sorry for Ákos Hadházy, Schiffer’s replacement, when he tried to rationalize his party’s strategy while claiming that his greatest desire is to get rid of Viktor Orbán’s regime. By now, however, I have decided that the new co-chair of LMP doesn’t deserve my sympathy. A sharp-tongued commentator in gepnarancs.hu called LMP “a closed ward,” indicating that he finds LMP’s leaders not quite sane. Of course, he quickly added: “pardon me, a closed structure.” In his opinion, “ever since the departure of their word-jongleur they wriggle like fish out of water.”

Együtt’s two-man leadership seems to have supreme confidence in their party’s weighty position in Hungarian politics. Consequently, Együtt wants separate lists to ensure parliamentary representation. Just as a reminder, in order to get into parliament, Együtt would need at least 5% of the votes. Meeting that threshold, however, would not ensure a separate parliamentary delegation, which in the current setup must have at least five members. For example, DK, which is a much larger party, currently has only four members and hence no delegation. Viktor Szigetvári, co-chair, is so sure of his party’s chances that he already announced in an interview that he will be the leader of the Együtt parliamentary delegation after 2018. I admire his confidence.

A growing sentiment within the opposition favors some kind of “understanding” between the democratic parties and Jobbik. After reading the pro-government papers I came to the conclusion that Fidesz is really worried about this possibility and is trying to prevent any such meeting of the minds. János Somogyi, a frequent contributor to Magyar Idők, devoted an opinion piece to the subject. Of course, he finds both sides abhorrent. He tries to convince himself that such an understanding will never happen. But if by some fluke it does, it matters not because Fidesz will win the election anyway. He concluded his article dramatically: “The Lord will hear the last words of Prime Minister László Bárdossy, who was innocently executed in January 1946. Holding his arms toward the sky, he said ‘My Lord, deliver the country from these bandits!’ Perhaps this will become reality in 2018.”

Naturally, democratically minded political commentators are divided on the issue. One unexpected promoter of the idea is Ágnes Heller, Hungary’s best-known philosopher who, by the way, is a Holocaust survivor. Here is Hungarian Free Press’s translation of what she had to say on the subject. The original appeared on the website of ATV.

Cooperation can happen if both sides desire it. Purely based on numbers it is true that if they went up against Fidesz together, they would defeat the governing party. It would not be bad if they did so. But if they don’t want to do it, then they should not…Maybe the word ‘cooperation’ is not the right one. They could just support each other. This, of course, would be very difficult to explain to their voters, even if today there is basically a state of emergency in Hungary. If this is impossible due to their divergent identities, they do not need to make ideological compromises. Instead of a public agreement, they can simply decide to support each other’s candidates, even as they both develop their own campaign strategies. And then, if Fidesz has been defeated, the current electoral system would be reformed and new elections would follow between the victorious parties.

Ágnes Heller

György Konrád, a well-known writer and also a Holocaust survivor, thinks that “one can even join forces with the grandmother of the devil as long as the goal of a democratic alteration of the electoral laws can be achieved.” He added that such an outcome is “improbable,” but “it cannot be totally excluded either.”

On the other hand, TGM, a political philosopher, Tamás Ungvári, a literary historian, and Mihály Kornis, a writer, find the idea totally unacceptable. Kornis, who has the tendency to exaggerate, declared that if the choice was between Jobbik and death he would choose death.

In brief, the Hungarian political scene is extremely complex, and carving out a winning strategy is a daunting task for the opposition.

January 9, 2017
Sort by:   newest | oldest | most voted
Guest

I would not describe the Hungarian political scene as complex.

On the left, it is confused, incoherent and racked with dissension, just a jumble of political pottery shards, each with one or two self-appointed geniuses in charge.

On the right, it is well organized, with strong leaderships putting forward straightforward and reasonably coherent Christian Nationalist (Fidesz) or National Socialist (Jobbik) political programs enjoying broad grassroots support in the electorate.

I frankly don’t think that the idea of electoral collaboration between Jobbik and MSZP, DK and the rest of the political pottery shards on the left has any legs at all.

What is more likely is a Fidesz-Jobbik coalition.

It is not difficult at all to think of a whole array of possible ideas and tactics that would enable Orbán to absolutely make sure that Jobbik lands on his side in the 2018 election, if push came to shove.

And if I can think of such ideas and tactics, then why wouldn’t Orbán and his contingency planning staff be thinking of them also, and more importantly, fleshing out their implementation details?

Guest

Sadly, the plight of the Hungarian left strongly reminds of Humpty Dumpty:

Humpty Dumpty sat on a wall,
Humpty Dumpty had a great fall;
All the king’s horses and all the king’s men
Couldn’t put Humpty together again.

Guest

I almost feel sorry that I have to agree with you there!

Hungary is a hopeless case, at least for the foreseeable future – unless something drastic happens, like:

The EU gets destroyed or destroys itself – no more money for Hungary, no more open borders, no more workplaces abroad for Hungarians …

A confrontation Trump vs Putin or Trump vs China which destroys the global economy …

Putin decides to “free” the Eastern states oppressed by the horrible EU and NATO …

Maybe someone has other ideas?

If nothing cataclysmic happens Hungary will just continue to rot away …
The rich will get obscenely richer, the poor will get poorer …
And those who are able will leave the country asap!

Guest

The pattern developing in contemporary Hungary is very familiar from Hungarian history.

The evolution of parvenu robber barons, a vulgarian nouveau riche class that becomes “nobility” and “aristocracy” a couple of generations down the track, their merciless and conscienceless exploitation of the masses (and today the EU) for personal gain, with hundreds of thousands escaping to greener pastures elsewhere and the presence of millions of beggars without hope or prospects of any kind.

Hungarian leadership, if it can be called that, can’t help itself: it seems to be in its nature to mindlessly follow precedent that – together with ceaseless dissension among the thiefs and robbers of the nation (that is however yet to occur in the contemporary context) – has been the bane and ruination of the land since the Middle Ages.

The thralldom of Hungarians to a semi-feudal mentality, and their consequent inability to generate an able, ethical and far-seeing political leadership from among themselves has always been the root cause of Hungary’s problems and the reason why Hungary’s history has been a history of serial failures for the past 500 [!!] years, in a never ending mix of the ghastly and the pathetic.

Observer
Guest
Your post is surprisingly under par: “On the right, it is well organized, with strong leaderships putting forward straightforward and reasonably coherent Christian Nationalist (Fidesz) or National Socialist (Jobbik) ..” etc. – The Fidesz fascist “light” (or quasi, fascistoid, etc) regime is FAR RIGHT. – Strong leadership – yes, befitting such regimes, befitting Central Asian roots. – No program – NONE at all as the cynical Orban said: Our program is one word: We’ll carry on, which was more than enough for the faithful. – Neither straight forward nor coherent: the constant twists and turns, ad hoc and ad hominem decisions, the countless changes in regulation have been held as the biggest problem for the Hungarian business and economy. Ditto for administration. Add institutionalized corruption. And don’t confuse words with deeds, as G.Fodor Gábor confessed – Polgári was just a slogan or Orban’s – Don’t listen to what I’m saying, look what I’m doing. – Christian …. Oh, please …. Just a hat they put on when useful. E.g. Putin took on going to church. – Jobbik has moved away from anything like Nazi (if that’s what you meant), although this new position is not consolidated yet. – Vona/Jobbik emerged… Read more »
Guest

I agree with your description and I understand your outrage.

My point is simply that what you describe of Fidesz IS actually the program that, in its “wisdom,” the Hungarian electorate had already voted for twice, and is more than likely to vote for again in 2018. I am also sure that Orbán will find a way of co-opting Jobbik into a Christian Nationalist/National Socialist parliamentary alliance with Fidesz.

The Christian Nationalist program is at once fascistoid and populist, and as such, a not so distant cousin of many aspects of National Socialism; it shows a straightforward consistency in its twists and turns, lying and deceit, which all aim at cementing the political power position of Fidesz and retaining it over the very long term whilst vastly enriching its rapidly emerging mob of vulgarian nouveau riche.

As to a Jobbik collaboration with the political pottery shards on the left in order to somehow unseat Orbán and his gang, I can only repeat that in my view this is sheer wishful thinking, and that the most likely outcome of the 2018 elections would be a Fidesz-Jobbik coalition.

Observer
Guest

ambalint
No outrage, just noting.

Straightforward and consistent are the methods of this party turned mafia, but not only there was noprogram, there were no indication of what the plans are, if any, for the second term. Speculations about “consolidation” of the regime (i.e. moderation in the Hungarian meaning) proved unfounded.

If we consider that the 2010 Fid program did not contain any of the drastic changes later rammed, nor the fact that many elements were not implemented, there is nothing straightforward or consistent, but the power grab and thievery.

On the Jobbik – Fid relationship we agree to disagree and we shall see.

wrfree
Guest

Just a point looking from the outside in. In my estimation until Magyar leadership disabuses itself of the notion that ‘good’ governcan operate within the swirling cesspool of morality gone awry in the society nothing absolutely nothing will change for the better in the country. They can talk ’till the tehen comes home but the selfish corruption and greed and the cry of ‘Me! Me! Me! stops any semblance of cooperatively moving ahead.

The country because of its leadership unfortunately is in the grip of that slippery moral world that has slowly eroded the will to work among the relevant politicians to achieve some unity. What to do? Perhaps a national re-evaluation of values. And the first item is to improve how people get along with each other and how they have set themselves up to interact with relationships.

webber
Guest

A fish stinks from its head.
Start with the elite, I say. Change them all, mercilessly, if needed (that’s what elections are meant to do – might not be effective in Hungary now though).

Guest

@Observer
Today 6:32 am

OK, you convinced me and I accept that I misspoke with the “straightforward” and “consistent” appellations.

:-))

e-1956
Guest

Lots of words by Michael. I am sympathizing with you, but it is better to come up with constructive thoughts.
The lifelong extraordinary policies of Ferenc Deak can be a good inspiration to renew the greatness of Hungary.

Guest

It is interesting that Heller, Konrád, TGM, Ungvári and Kornis are all people of Jewish descent. Where are the non-Jewish commentators?

If these people are supposedly some of the leading intellectual lights on the Hungarian left, then the left is utterly doomed in that basically very antisemitic country.

Given that liberal democracy is popularly seen by many, many Hungarians as a product of global Jewish conspiracy specifically directed at their country, in my most humble opinion prominent left-wing Hungarian Jews would do themselves and their political cause an enormous favor if they made sure to absolutely stay out of the political limelight instead of busily preening themselves in it.

Observer
Guest

Valid point (but don’t try this at home, e.g. in the US or Oz).
Such statements, laments, accusations are routine in Hungary. I also think this is often counterproductive, but this is how things are.
Look who runs the media at home, or in most Western countries for that matter. Or the entertainment, the financial sector, the scientific research, the arts ? Shall a society limit the achievers, because of their ethnicity? Had been tried, with bad to terrible results for all. (Stalin’s last round of mainly antisemitic terror in 1949-1952 slowed down the military scientific research).

Guest

Hungary is in a curious position: uniquely in Eastern Europe there are still some tens of thousands of people of indigenous Jewish descent from overwhelmingly of ex-communist family backgrounds that have since the eighties morphed into some or another form of left-liberal political orientation, in a country where however virulent grassroots antisemitism is rife everywhere and the mainstream political orientation is emphatically illiberal.

My above comment was therefore strictly Hungary-specific. The situation in contemporary Hungary in regard to people of Jewish descent can only be described as truly bizarre.

The issue simply does not arise here in Australia.

Observer
Guest

Wouldn’t call it bizarre, eg Germany had the most assimilated Jewish population and yet there happened one of the worst, if not the, genocides in history.

The same kind of Antisemitism could/can be observed in similar societies: agrarian, underdeveloped, retrograde – parts of Russai, Ukraine and Poland. The Jews and Germans of these countries developed their modern economic units – factories, banks, power plants, trade and education facilities.
E.g. Look at the list of the richest people in Hungary in the 30s.
In the same period the deteriorating Hungarian gentry used to say with derision that trade, money dealings (banking) and workshops were for the (despised) Jews. And I don’t mean 1730s, but 1930s.

Guest
@Observer Today 6:47 am I am well aware of the history you refer to, but when I used the appellation “bizarre,” I referred specifically to the situation of people of Jewish descent in contemporary Hungary. I use the term “people of Jewish descent” advisedly, because whilst they are considered “despicable Jews” by the vast majority of their non-Jewish compatriots, they themselves rarely if ever identify themselves as Jewish, apart from a few thousand religiously inclined among them. Most are intermarried or children or grandchildren of intermarriages, intent on full assimilation to the maximum extent that the generally antisemitic environment will let them, in fact tend to hide and conceal their Jewish origins (however meager its extent might actually be), and have generally nothing to do with Jewish religious, communal and/or cultural life. In fact, they generally wish that this whole Jewish “thing” would just disappear somehow and that mainstream non-Jewish Hungarian society would just let them be ordinary, plain vanilla Hungarians without forcing them to wear forever the “stigma” of their Jewish origins. And truth to tell, actually many succeed quite brilliantly in melting and disappearing into the Hungarian non-Jewish mainstream. (And good luck to them, of course!). What is… Read more »
Observer
Guest

My recipe is:

Learn from and emulate the leaders, and beat them at their game.
Everything else is a net loss game for a society.

András B. Göllner
Guest

It’s far more surprising, that the above named commentators are all in their eighties or nineties, and not a single one is a bona fide political, or policy analyst. If they held power, in spite of my admiration of the fire in their belly, they would probably drive Hungary into the nearest ditch.

What is lamentable is, that that voice of “progressive”outrage, progressive alternative to Orbán’s affinity fraud is almost totally absent in middle class, millenial circles. Hungary’s university crowd shares the same phobias, prejudices as those who voted Orbán into power. Hungary’s business class shows no signs of social responsibility. Workers and peasants ? Yawn…The intellectual class is ready to sell it’s soul – intellect – to the lowest common denominator. At least the above named elderly “Jews” are not afraid to speak out publicly. Let us please, give them that acknowledgement.

Guest

@András B. Göllner
Today 11.26 am

I agree with everything you say except perhaps your last point where I continue to reserve my judgement about the political wisdom of appearing in an “all-Jewish” group as implicit spokespersons of the Hungarian Left.

webber
Guest

OT – Soros and his foundations will be the next target of a government hate campaign in Hungary. I would not be surprised of Orban and crew ejected CEU from Hungary within a year. Story here:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/jan/10/fears-new-crackdown-civil-society-groups-hungary-george-soros

Bowen
Guest

CEU could move elsewhere of course (Bratislava? Cluj?). But it would mean the death knell of one of the last vibrant, liberal communities in Budapest.

webber
Guest

Dubrovnik, Vienna (why not?), Zagreb, Ljubljana (gorgeous town), Tallinn, Riga, Vilnius, Brno…. There are plenty of places for CEU to go without losing its identity.

Guest

Another exodus of talent from Hungary?

Why not, it’s a century old tradition – and the receiving countries were always very happy, just think about scientists like von Neumann, Szilard, Teller, Gabor (holography Nobel prize winner), Polya …
I don’t know too much about other academic fields besids math and physics but you can surely find more examples …

webber
Guest

Historian: Oscar (Oszkár) Jászi.
Philosopher: Aurel Kolnai
Sociologist: Karl Manheim.
Lawyer: Rusztem Vámbéry.
Painter: László Moholy-Nagy.
Journalist: George (György) Palóczi-Horváth.
And there are many more, some listed in the books on Hungarian exiles by Tibor Frank (Double Exile) and Lee Congdon (Exile and Social Thought).

Bowen
Guest

I only mentioned Cluj because there were proposals at one point to move CEU there. And, of course, quite a lot of the Hungarians working at OSI are not ‘Hungarian-Hungarians’ anyway.

rotkiw
Guest
And I’m sure that the Trump administration will help Orban in his efforts. Especially as the US hasn’t done anything to help Soros even though Soros was one of the very first supporters of (senator) Obama and one of the biggest donors to the Democratic Party ever – now imagine if Trump could have the chance to make examples out of some of his “liberal enemies”, now that could make liberals fall in line in no time. Putin and Netanyahu will supply precious know-how (they probably did already). Nothing, I repeat nothing provides more enjoyment for Orban than when he hears liberals scream. He would do it just to show he can do it, but he will also do it because it is the best fun. I’m afraid Oban will close down CEU and other Soros-related foundations just to make liberals crystal clear: there’s nobody in the world who will defend them not the US, not the EU, not Israel, nobody. Simple victory is never enough: the defeated must completely internalize that they have no hope left and history will soon forget about them as if they never existed. Such plans against “enemy agents” (as they are called both in… Read more »
Guest

There are indeed many acutely disturbing parallels between the respective nationalist political leaderships of Hungary and Israel.

Orbán and Netanyahu are well and truly the same kind of extreme nationalist slimeballs. The only real difference between them is the fact that Israel continues to fight for its life in an unforgiving Arab environment that will never accept in its midst a sovereign Jewish entity that it perceives as a colonial intruder on what it regards as Arab sovereign territory. Thus Soros-funded and other NGOs designed to severely sabotage Israel’s fight for survival are less and less tolerated by the Israeli public and government alike.

Hungary does not of course have to contend with this kind of existential problem, yet is is beginning to behave toward Soros-funded and other NGOs much like the Israelis, as though Hungary too was fighting for its life against those who would, if they could, severely sabotage its illiberal political set-up.

Guest

@webber
Today 2:08 am

I agree, and I foresaw this coming years ago, as soon as Orbán abolished all key constitutional checks and balances in Hungary.

As a citadel of liberal democratic thinking, teaching and research, the CEU sticks out like an sore thumb in the illiberal political landscape of Hungary.

The existence of such an institution must be absolutely intolerable for Orbán and his gang, and I am sure that as far as they are concerned, the sooner it gets booted out of Hungary, the better.

Observer
Guest

It goes with the system.
Like most dictators, particularly the ones of lowly origin, Orban doesn’t care about the steep decline in Hun education quality/results, about the exodus of the best and brightest, or lagging in research and innovation or about the degradation of the of the administration apparatus. As long as he is on top of the dump heap.
This is why dictatorships fall, circus is not enough if their stifled systems can’t provide the bread. But it’s a painful and often long process.
Hajra! kitartás.

Ferenc
Guest
What is THE main problem for Hungary being a real and fair democracy? My answer: the current Electoral Law (of 2011) Who agrees with these laws? Fidesz&Co (they made them!), but any other party? Who wants to change these laws? (almost) all other parties (don’t know Jobbik’s view, so appreciate if anybody can clarify this) How can the Electoral Law be changed? 1.option: a referendum, probably not possible (otherwise it would have been held already!) under the current rules. 2.option: making this THE main point of the coming election, so using the election as a sort of referendum about the Electoral Law. All parties, who want to go for option 2, shouldn’t think about how to work together on other items, only changing the Electoral Law first of all, and just be open about if any serious governing might be possible afterwards. If this law is not changed within 1.5 years from now, I very much fear for the (democratic) future of the people in Hungary! It could take till after the burial of OV, according current life expectancy for men in Hungary, that could be around 2035 (1963+72), so some 11 years after the 2024 games, until any change… Read more »
Ferenc
Guest

The best billboard/poster/etc. text for option 2 are simply the plain results from the last 2 elections:

Fidesz&Co: (2010) 53% votes => 68% seats
Fidesz&Co: (2014) 45% votes => 67% seats

Other Parties (2010): 47% votes => 32% seats
Other Parties (2014): 55% votes => 33% seats

We want: % votes = % seats!!
Choose for REAL Democracy!!

Ferenc
Guest

OT
(Another) bad omen, footbal worldchampiomships from 32 upto 48 teams (in 2026). So first 16 groups with 3 teams and then 6 rounds to go from 32 till the winner is known. Will this result into the best team to win? Could be, but imho less chance to do so.
And why all of this? More teams can play, some 16 extra matches, and expected extra income of 1 billion Euro (for FIFA).
Good for football? Not in my opinion: less change the best will win, and less countries will have the possibility to organize!

bimbi
Guest

I did like the quote from Janos Somogyi in Magyar Idok:

“…Holding his arms toward the sky, he said, ‘My Lord, deliver the country from these bandits!’ Perhaps this will become reality in 2018.”

Sounds as if Mr. Somogyi is writing his own epitaph and that for the current government It couldn’t happen to a nicer bunch of bandits.

Tyrker
Guest

“And then, if Fidesz has been defeated, the current electoral system would be reformed and new elections would follow between the victorious parties.”

Between the victorious parties? Does she think that just because the opposition parties manage (if they manage) to deprive Fidesz of its parliamentary majority, they will also manage to deprive Fidesz of its right to participate in the “reformed” elections?

Guest

I agree, Heller has very clumsily misspoken in this instance (I checked it out in Hungarian too). Most uncharacteristically so, for that old lady.

Istvan
Guest
Ms Heller said nothing of substance because she is walking a tight rope on the block with the Jobbik. In order not to offend liberals who see removing Orban as task #1 she dances around the very nature of Jobbik. Moreover, she knows Lajos Simicska lurks in the dark behind advocacy for a left right block to defeat Orban. I agree with ambalint that electoral unity with the Jobbik has little traction, honestly I am thankful for that. As to Eva pointing out the Fidesz media onslaught against the Jobbik, she is right it’s happening and I pointed this out last week too. But maybe not just out of fear of an electoral coalition, but also in an attempt to ferment a revolt against Vona within the Jobbik. I suspect that Fidesz fears Vona as a personality more than Jobbik as political party. I have been reading the comments in numerous posts from the hard right anti Semitic Jobbik against Vona. Orban is not incorrect in sensing an opportunity, the new reasonable Vona is not seen as a tactical maneuver to seize power in order to further promote a fascist agenda by this wing of the Jobbik including elected officials.… Read more »
Ferenc
Guest

Yeah, Simicska and all what belongs to him.
I check regularly his HIRTV, and some current programs are quit OK, especially in which representatives of various media (mainly newspapers and online) are discussing actual items. In Foszerkeszto Klubja and Lapzarta there are always left/right/(middle) points of views.
But what’s the current aim with his whole ventures? Can he really be trusted (after having worked together so long with OV/Fidesz)? Did he ever open up the book about how OV/Fidesz operates (I can not imagine that he doesn’t know some unknown secrets)?

webber
Guest

Simicska just made Ildiko Vida, former head of Orban’s tax authority, head of one of his companies. Of course he knows certain secrets. And Orban knows a few about him, too.

Observer
Guest

Orban and many of the current capos will not be eligible for nomination, being in preliminary detention in curruption investigations.

The, current Fidesz organisation may be found to be an organized crime one and disbanded. For efficiency by another “semmissègi” law (after all the sitting Constitutional Court judge Istvàn Balsai tabled the first such bill).

Ferenc
Guest

OT
Fidesz will start (new) war against NGO’s, here a fresh news report from HIRTV (so NOT hirtv’s opinion!):
http://hirtv.hu/videok/171907
and of course Fidesz tries to use: previous elections (don’t know who judges that as real democratic), referendum (not valid!), Trump (lost public vote), etc
about NGO’s: ‘el kell innen takarodni’ – have to be kicked out of here
more of the speech (full?): http://hirtv.hu/videok/171912

pappp
Guest
Re Soros This time failure is not an option for Szilárd Németh. His career is on the line and he has absolutely everything, the entire state administration (ie. the secret services as supported by Russia and, I guess, in this matter the US too) and media at his disposal. I think he is terrified he can’t deliver. Orban needs a real victory and victory against ‘internal enemies’ is great for popularity and is especially great for his fan base which is starting to entertain doubts about the invincibility of the dear leader. After the migrant referendum it looked as though Orban lost his mojo (remember the faces of those fideszniks when the abysmal turnout figures became public), it looked as though liberals might have an opportunity to mock Orban. Nope, Népszabadság was duly shut down just to show that Power is still with Orban. And now the last liberal bastions will be shut down too, I’m afraid. Orban simply cannot allow any defeat associated with his name for long and he cannot be allowed to look like he is losing his all-powerfulness. That’s his most important image trait and it cannot ever be in doubt. Humiliating and tormenting liberals (often… Read more »
Observer
Guest

Papp

“Orban needs … victory against “internal enemies” ..for his fan base”

Spot on, this why these regimes always notch up the repression, their failures have to be hidden, repainted, the plebs has to be controlled and it’s anger channeled against internal and external “enemies” in a never ending struggle, Revolution (eg Cuba/Castro)

Guest

OT

Meryl Streep’s anti-Trump speech. The empire hits back.

Russia Bans Meryl Streep Movies. In an appearance on state television, Russian President Vladimir Putin offered no reason for the ban, other than to say that Streep was “overrated.”

http://russia.trendolizer.com/2017/01/russia-bans-meryl-streep-movies.html

Ferenc
Guest

Well it’s not impossible to happen, but my first thought is that this is fake-news. So are you sure???????

Guest

Not absolutely. I have read the story in different places. I quoted one. Maybe I was fooled.

Guest

No. It seems that I was fooled.

Guest

Jean, sometimes it’s really difficult to differentiate between unbelivable stuff and fake or satire!
My favourite debunking site is snopes.com – they are very good. And I have a “list” of so called news sites which I don’t believe at all like RT (Russia Today), breitbart, Fox etc.

Guest

The source given is the Borowitz report, a well known satire site in the NewYorker (I’ve subscribed to it …) – so of course it’s satire!
Borowitz is no fun of Trump as you can imagine:
http://www.newyorker.com/humor/borowitz-report
The headline before this was:
Calling the recent allegations against Russia a “witch hunt,” Trump told intelligence chiefs that their investigations of Putin were distracting them from “America’s real enemy, actresses.”

Growing increasingly irate, he laid out a series of proposals for dealing with what he called a “scourge,” including mandatory registration of actresses and a temporary ban on actresses entering the country.”

wpDiscuz