Viktor Orbán’s “ethnically homogeneous” Hungary

Viktor Orbán’s latest address, delivered yesterday at the Hungarian Chamber of Commerce’s annual gathering, has already become notorious. The lengthy speech was intended to give an overview of the Hungarian economy, which the Hungarian prime minister described as “not good but promising.” As usual, he said nothing noteworthy on that front. He did, however, give the Chamber a lecture on genetics, ethnicity, and culture which without exaggeration can be described as unadulterated racism.

The portion of the speech devoted to “cultural and ethnic homogeneity” is relatively short but damning nonetheless. One commentator, András Hont of HVG, who used to be a friend of Orbán back in the early 1990s, recorded the changes of his feelings about the prime minister. First, he felt admiration, later disappointment and suspicion, but after reading this speech he “feels only revulsion.” Strong words but not undeserved.

Let’s turn to the text that elicited such a strong reaction not just in Hungary but abroad as well. Orbán probably realized the risk involved in entering into a discussion of such a “delicate” subject. Thus he began this part of his speech by paying homage to the resurgence of politically incorrect speech in Hungary: “By now one can say such things. A few years ago one could be executed for such sentences, but today one can say it because life confirmed that too much mixing brings trouble.” What’s too much mixing and what’s not? I think it is pretty clear from the text that mixing within the European community is acceptable as far as Orbán is concerned, but any mixing with people coming from “different cultures” is not. He admits—he can’t do otherwise—that today’s Hungarians are ethnically extremely varied, but he looks upon the Hungarian nation as ethnically homogeneous because it is made up of European stock.

Naturally, when a Hungarian speaks of ethnic diversity, sooner or later we will hear the advice of Hungary’s first king to his son about the wisdom of inviting foreigners into the country “because a kingdom where only one language is spoken and only one custom is followed is weak and fragile.” And indeed Orbán made a fleeting reference to St. Stephen’s wisdom, but he added that “one mustn’t endanger the country’s basic ethnic character.” The presence of an alien stock wouldn’t improve the value of the country; on the contrary, “it would devalue it and thrust it into chaos.” He is all for “cultural diversity within [the European] context, but the existence of parallel societies that are incapable of assimilation” must be avoided at all costs. Orbán is convinced that if “we manage to uphold the [country’s] ethnic homogeneity and its cultural uniformity, then Hungary will be upgraded as a place. Hungary will be the kind of place that will be able to show other, more developed countries what they lost.”

A few weeks ago we were laughing over Orbán’s remarks about the West European refugees who will be coming to Hungary. We thought he was joking. Well, he is not joking. He truly believes that Hungary will be a European paradise which white Europeans will envy and perhaps move to.

The same theme cropped up again in a later part of the speech, when Orbán said that he doesn’t want the importation of “guest workers,” although it is becoming painfully clear that there is a serious labor shortage in Hungary. He wants a country where all jobs are filled by Hungarians, from the cleaning lady to the president of the Hungarian National Academy. In Western European countries immigrants do the menial jobs. But not in Hungary, where ethnic purity will enhance the value of the country. It will be a country that is being run from top to bottom by Hungarians.

The Chamber also received a lecture about the “idea of greatness.” Hungary might be small, but Hungarians understand the “meaning of greatness.” Hungarians “cannot relinquish the idea of greatness in culture, greatness in sports, greatness in science.” He continued: “We are not simply a nation in the Carpathian Basin but we are a great nation, quite independently from the fact that at the moment we are shrunken and demographically declining. However, that doesn’t change the thousand-year-old fact that we are a great nation. People who live in this country think of themselves as such.” This attitude, to Orbán’s way of thinking, is also a plus in the eyes of others, which I very much doubt. Perhaps megalomania would be a better description of Orbán’s ideas on the greatness of his nation.

Most commentators misunderstood the message. Some people got stuck on the ethnic diversity of Hungarians and brought up examples to prove that Orbán doesn’t know what he is talking about. For example, 24.hu gave the ethnic backgrounds of the thirteen generals who were executed after the 1848-49 revolution and war of independence and triumphantly announced that only four of them were ethnically Hungarians. But this is not what Orbán was talking about. He has nothing against white Europeans. He was talking about people whose skin is darker and who are not Christians. This was a speech with a racist message, pure and simple. Normally, Orbán couches his less than acceptable ideas in coded phrases that can easily be explained away if necessary. But he seems to be emboldened as a result of the political changes in the United States, and he no longer even pretends when it comes to the subject of race relations.

The Jewish weekly Szombat published an opinion piece which analyzed the text more deeply. The author discovered a sentence that stood apart from the passage on ethnic homogeneity. Here Orbán called “Hungary’s ethnic relations complicated.” He was undoubtedly referring to the large Roma population in the country. Thus, the commentator translated Orbán’s thinking on the subject: “We have enough problems with our own ethnic relations. We don’t need an immigrant ethnic group.” What really bothered the author, however, was the “ethnic homogeneity” phrase, which can be understood as “ethnic purity.” With this, he wrote, “we are back to the word usage of the Central European dictatorships of the 1930s.” I’m afraid I have to agree with him. This time it is impossible to explain away Viktor Orbán’s message.

March 1, 2017
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Ocsi
Guest

What a disgrace! The EU should suspend Hungary’s membership until this man disappears.

e-1956
Guest

Only very few people are familiar with the Russian roots of the 1920-1945 fascism. After WWII, the West has been challenged by Moscow on various levels uninterruptedly, and the Western leaders have been failing to defend the planet against the State of Russia.

Our Hungarian history has been very sad for the last 100-120 years peppered by endless tragedies.

Perhaps a future Ferenc Deak can govern Hungary out of its grave.

Guest

to e-1956

And look what your friend Orbán is doing, viz the “challenge” by Moscow? Buckling under and paying homage to the latest corrupt Russian leader, whom he holds in high esteem.

Fideszniks use the reds-under-the-beds tactic as a smokescreen to do anything they like by pillaging the nation of all its resources and becoming wealthy oligarchs, exactly like the dreaded communist corrupt leaders they say they despise.

Karl Pfeifer
Guest

Nonsense, fascism had Italian roots and had not much to do with Russian communism. After WWII, The Western Democracies defended Democracy often enough with protecting and helping real fascists. This happened in Spain and in Greece. The Democracies could beat Hitler and his allies only in Alliance with the URSS and so except Finland and Austria those countries liberated by the Red Army were forced (probably with the exception of CSR) to have “real socialism”.
So let us not blame the West for the Facts of geography. Let us not believe that Hungary and Hungarians were always victims. Hungarians should not dream about Deák and Great Hungary before Trianon, but try to return to liberal democracy.

Karl Pfeifer
Guest

The association of European peoples parties should kick Fidesz out. But they will not, because without Fidesz they would loose majority in European parliament.

Observer
Guest

The same silly lack of foresight as in Munich 39.

e-1956
Guest

I really like your vision. We all should study those past dark days to see the current events correctly.
Munich 1939 was just one big failure of the Western leaders.
The early days of fascist Munich, with the assistance of the Baltic and Tsarist Russians are not well known. (See Max Erwin von Scheubner-Richter) Sadly, even the German nation was a victim of a historical deceit. Our current historians may take a fresh look at the event of Munich. 1917-1923.

wrfree
Guest

Re: ‘Perhaps a future Ferenc Deak can govern Hungary out of its grave’

I can recall standing in Hosok Ter completely in awe of the statues of the kings looking majestic on horseback. They were the leadership of the country during various eras. What can they think of the nation now and how posterity has kept faith with them and their visions?

For the country in its development has apparently done a major right oblique veering and plummeting onward to a corrosive form of supposedly ‘democratic’ and ‘good’ government where it’s tenets are all out of whack. And it is all put forward by its leader. Consequently the impoverished country along so many levels probably should believe it is time to once again send the ‘raven with the ring’. A country and a people need to be saved. Desperately.

wrfree
Guest

Re: Munich 1939

Lines written by Chamberlain after he met with Hitler discussing self-determination for the Sudeten Germans:

‘I have come back again rather quicker than I expected, after a journey which, had I not been so preoccupied , I should have found thoroughly enjoyable. Yesterday afternoon I had a long talk with Herr Hitler. It was a frank talk, but it was a friendly one, and I feel satisfied now that each of us fully understands what is in the mind of the other’. ‘In Search of Peace…The Crisis’ , Rt Honorable Neville Chamberlain

And well we all know where those assumptions went to.

Primer for possible future European negotiators engaging with those active in matters of ‘homogeneity’. So…

Watch out for ‘friendliness’. And don’t even think one can ‘fully understand’ what is in the mind of the other after having a nice chat.

bimbi
Guest

Can we at least get the year right, if not the date? The dreaded (and shabby) Munich Agreement was 30 September 1938. OK – back to the professionals…

Observer
Guest

Bombing
It’s 1938 of course. Sorry. U may have noticed there are many mistakes in my posts, mostly due to my typing on iPad and my reluctance to bore everyone with corrections.
Sorry.

Observer
Guest

Bimbi not Bombing. See what I mean

Ferenc
Guest

As any EU decision takes many years, it is best:
1.that the Hungarian people as sson as possible put (or more strongly: kick) OV out of power
2.afterwards don’t let themselves be corrupted by one filler of all his and his strawmen’s forints (or any other kind of money/wealth/etc).

Grant Boyd-Gibbins
Guest

Would many Hungarians find anything objectionable in this speech? Belief in Hungarian exceptionalism seems widespread and that includes attitudes about enviable ethnicity.

Observer
Guest

Not many, on a cognitive basis. The mass moves on emotions, just as in the Brexit, Trump cases.
The H case, however, is a pretty aggravated one: the conviction of the Japanese racism, without the politeness, under the raggish pretenses of contemporary Hungary.

Observer
Guest

Nationalism is the last refuge of a scoundrel.

Member

Ein Volk, Ein Reich und (of course) Ein Fuhrer.
It is the Fidesz Mission Statement.

petofi
Guest

Why does Orban talk?

To find out what he’s thinking…

Ferenc
Guest

…..but he keeps trying to hold speeches ……….. so he still doesn’t understand that he can’t think either………

Guest

Unbelievable crap! That’s all I can say.

Maybe one day this will be ackowledged as the beginning of the end of O’s regime.

Totally OT:
Last summer we had visitors – my wife’s sister’s grandchildren who live in the USA (The whole family right now got US citizenship – very lucky) with friends – one of them a very nice girl from a Muslim family.

Right now I saw her venting her anger against Donald and his crazy ideas on facebook – she’s not afraid!

I never thought that Nationalism, Racism and Facism would rear its ugly head again after what we’ve been through – but it seems I was wrong.
Will humanity never learn?

Observer
Guest

wolfi7777
No it won’t.
The genetic programs took hundreds of thousands of years to develop for a purpose – forgetting is part of the learning process.
Civics/culture are the quick add-ons, but the human reactions pose restrictions on what they can do/achieve. Not for nothing was education appreciated and fostered for 4000 years at least.
But playing on the atavistic/instincts, i.e. populism, is easier and brings quick success in the short term.

Ferenc
Guest
“few weeks ago we were laughing over Orbán’s remarks about the West European refugees” Sorry, but I wasn’t laughing. When I first hit that quote about European refugees from his ‘state of the country’ speech, in the English summary on kormany.hu, I was shocked, flabbergasted, angry. There it wasn’t really in context and plainly written down (by his own major mouthpiece!) without the reaction of the listeners to his speech. So it was brought probably as serious as it was really in his mind!!! The listeners to his speech started laughing, I think, not because they understood it as a joke, but they were first stunned that OV started positive about ‘real’ refugees (not about his usual illegal immigrants!) and then explaining what these were supposed to be. [ha ha ha, very funny, West-European real refugees] That bunch of people ‘hanging at his lips’ didn’t get it, he REALLY was serious!!!! “at the moment we are shrunken and demographically declining” Note: that he first speaks about the area aka.km2 and then secondary about the declining population in Hungary. I noticed that this order is consequently used in all talk and writings directly and/or indirectly referring to the 100 years ago… Read more »
Observer
Guest

C’on guys,
You overanalyze the speech, he’s been mouthing this for 20 years, check any speech for great (nagy), strong, historical, struggle, victory. The ethnic purity was not often mentioned until the anti-migration campaign. But the whole thing remains his usual primitive, populist jumble. Let’s improve on it:
“Hungary IS be the kind of place that will be able to show other, more developed countries what they GOT RID OF.”
“In Western European countries immigrants do the menial jobs. But not in Hungary, [why? Because the Hungarians who can’t do better ones]. …”
“It will be a country that is being run from top to bottom by Hungarians [i.e. by the orban mafia]”
“..we are a great nation, quite independently from the fact that [that we are not great, because] at the moment we are shrunken and demographically declining, [falling behind in every other aspect, getting dumber and poorer].

e-1956
Guest

Observer, you are so right. You can see under the surface. I am so glad to read your wise comments.

Observer
Guest

Add to the above, that Orban has been a closet/unconscious fascist for more than 20 years. It is just showing better now – as they say: many man can stand adversity, but to test a man’s character give him power.
See him now, lecturing each and all on anything, from nuclear to menial jobs, from history and religion to societal development trends in Europe and the world…
He’s going off the hinges, down the road of Cseausescu and Stalin who were “clearly seeing the future”,”geniuses”,”giants in science” etc. It is coming.

wrfree
Guest

Re: ‘we are a great nation… at the moment we are shrunken… falling behind…gettibg dumber and poorer’

Tough to see the actual reality relative to ‘greatness’. It would appear the country contrary to government opinion is suffering ‘greatly’. It is there where ‘greatness’ shows its face. Perhaps in a way the suffering can be considered a reflection of the expiation of guilt as the nation’s avowed leaders appear to be blind and oblivious to where their stewardship of the country is taking them.

pappp
Guest

After Trump and Duterte anything goes. The more outrageous things Orban says and does the more he’s talked about. In the last year before the 2018 election this is what counts: who is talked about more.

Nobody even heard about Momentum in rural Zala or Bács county where Orban is still beloved.

The Budapest Olympics issue is over. Now we can go back bashing the migráncsokat, George Soros, the EU, the US, the jews, godless communists or whoever. Hate works politically on several levels so Orban will use hate, simple as that.

Miklos
Guest

And here we go again. The moment OV has suffered a defeat he says something outrageous so everybody will speak about that and not what should be the topic. This way he controls also the media that he doesn’t own yet. Who case that he said something racist of fascist or he insults his Western allies? We already know he is a racist and he is probably even mentally ill. The focus should be on all the crimes he is doing and how he is failing as a politician. Right now the main focus should be on the Olympic games and why 50 million Euro was already spend when it’s clear that Fidesz knew the population didn’t support the idea. Other cases of crimes and defeat can always be in the news, but never what this wannabe-dictator says.

Miklos
Guest

I can’t edit the text…It should be who cares that he said something…

Observer
Guest

Yes, this is a tool of theirs, however this road leads always deeper, eg. the Fid rhetoric has gone already beyond the Jobbik, and their base still screams hate.
But the crap, the absurdities, the vulgar primitivism pile up, undecided decide, many civilized Fid supporters distance themselves.
The problem is media, as noted, the larger part of the country is restricted to gov/Fid media, so people there know nothing of what we read about here, looking out from Felcsut the Earth looks flat.

Ferenc
Guest
OT – upcoming elections in EU countries Dutch/French/German readers IMAGINE: In the coming Dutch/French/German elections (the party of) Geert Wilders/Marine Le Pen/Frauke Petry receives the most votes and wins the election. As not any other big party wants to cooperate with his/her party, formation of a government will be very difficult. Finally resulting that despite all intentions by all other parties otherwise a government will be formed with the PVV/FN/AfD and GW/MLP/FP as prime-minister/president/chancellor (remember his/her party became the biggest). As he/she before elections was very vague about real intentions and policies, basically many things can happen. Now suppose that premier GW/president MLP/chancellor FP will start with actions similar to Viktor Orban in Hungary, herewith a list of possibilities: •modification of the constitution (e.g.Islam will not be longer recognized as a religion) •modification of the election laws (e.g.the biggest party will always receive more than half of the seats in parliament, his/her reasoning making the democracy “more effective”) •other parties are compensated by extra seats in another democratic institution •the responsibilities of that other institution will simultaneously be reduced to zero influence (so turned into a bogus democratic institution) •the state broadcasting system will be reformed, e.g.all state RTV stations… Read more »
Beowulf
Guest

Egads!!! What unrelenting, unrelieved, unadulterated crap

Ferenc
Guest

Why, please explain.

Ferenc
Guest
I wrote the above big post first to a comedian in my country, to try to provoke some interest for the situation in Hungary. Basically here in Western-Europe it is difficult to get through to people what’s really going in Hungary. The way I did it felt very confronting to me and works two ways, first for warning about the local political situation and second for explaining the situation in Hungary. Then after having watched the LIBE hearing in the EU parliament about fundamental rights in Hungary, I decided to include the text in mails to members of EU parliament. [after first some questions to them about the hearing itself, still awaiting answers, the EU isn’t so fast…….] When I wrote the original text I ended my mails with: “if you send this mail through to others, not addressed by me directly, please TAKE OUT my name; reason: I don’t want relatives living and working in Hungary to get into any kind of trouble (e.g.fired from work) because of my letter” [note: this is a literal request from relatives] To post the text here I broadened the scope to the three countries in which soon will be held important elections.… Read more »
Gardonista
Guest

I think this statement breaks in ground in showing Orban to be an obvious racist. The odd thing is that nobody cares.

Istvan
Guest
Eva writes: “This was a speech with a racist message, pure and simple. Normally, Orbán couches his less than acceptable ideas in coded phrases that can easily be explained away if necessary. But he seems to be emboldened as a result of the political changes in the United States, and he no longer even pretends when it comes to the subject of race relations.” I agree with Eva that Orban normally uses ambiguous language when discussing the white nature of Hungary and the need to keep it that way. I like that Eva links President Trump’s not so subtle racism to the Orban speech, but it’s a hard correlation to establish. Eva’s written at least two very good essays on the genetic mythology of the contemporary Hungarian people, http://hungarianspectrum.org/2015/05/03/genetic-map-of-europe-and-the-tisza-people-of-the-hungarian-great-plain/ and http://hungarianspectrum.org/2009/11/05/genetic-markers-in-the-hungarian-population-then-and-now/ . Possibly Orban is attempting to completely jettison the Attila the Hun genetic myth to Hungarians in favor of a more generic white label. In a manner similar to how the Nazis claimed to observe scientifically a strict hierarchy of human race. Best reflected in Hitler’s view towards race and people in Chapter 11 of his book, Mein Kampf. The Ayran became largely “white people” minus of course the… Read more »
wrfree
Guest

And just a point. With the old boy’s dream of a futbol kingdom I’m just trying to figure out how he can win with only those of the ‘white’ persuasion.He is in dreamland.

Ferenc
Guest

Mentioned András Hont of HVG is each Thursday, so should be also today, in HirTV’s program ‘Csorte’ (live TV at 20hrs local time, and internet +1hr later broadcast), it’s a show in which 4 reporters (left/middle/right) have a tough public debate like fencing against each other.
Todays show could include a discussion about OV’s speech!!
The program is archived some days later and can then be accesed from here: http://hirtv.hu/csorte

Ferenc
Guest

+1hr internet broadcast can be watched from here http://hirtv.hu/hirtv_kesleltetett (and starts about now)

Ferenc
Guest

Unfortunately Andras Hont is this time not in the panel, but the discussion will be about OV’s speech

Observer
Guest

Adding to the already nasty picture today came a merry go round of shameless lies:
Asked about the ethnic purity expression, the Chief Lying Toad Z.Kovacs answered that Orban said “cultural homogenity … as in the written speech in his hand”.
In the mean time the text on the gov website was found to have been so amended.
Gov Lying Toad B.Havasi repeated the lie although the sound clip was played repeatedly on Klub radio.

In Orbanistan one better believe the regime rather than one’s eyes or ears.

Ferenc
Guest

OT – “smart fence”
New measures by the Hungarian government at the South border: behind the first fence (completed and closed in 2015.Sep) will be built a second fence, so called ‘smart fence’.
I suppose the first one was built with waste from Nokia mobiles, so the one will be made out of old iPhone materials……….
Oh that bunch of bad clowns is so tiresome to listen to with their blow-up empty blablabla.
http://www.atv.hu/belfold/20170302-nezze-nalunk-eloben-lazar-janos-sajtotajekoztatojat

PS: reasoning for all that new work is, that there is still an enormous pressure on the first fence by the 800.000 ‘illegal immigrants’ stuck in the Balkan between Turkey and Europe. At the moment trying to check if that data is correct, will comment here if I know more.

Ferenc
Guest

OT – current energy policy in Hungary:
-for sustainable energy systems (suncollectors, sunpanels, windturbines, you name it): new extra tax and other costs, making that even producers are leaving the country (to Slovakia)
-for nuclear energy: continuous propaganda and pressure that that is absolutely essential for the country (of course also completely forgetting to mention the costs to keep that all safe till every used element is not causing any danger anymore for the environment after some 1.000s of years)

One Question to the Hungarian Government: WHY??????

And please nobody else answers this in ‘their name’, THEY have to answer this simple question……
Here you can watch a related interview (with LMP representative): http://www.atv.hu/videok/video-20170301-marciustol-adot-kell-fizetni-a-napelemes-rendszerek-utan

pappp
Guest

A good introduction (in English) in the Hungarian media landscape – now overwhelmingly controlled by Orban and Fidesz.

https://univiennamedialab.wordpress.com/2017/02/23/his-majestys-media-from-state-capture-to-controlled-market-hungarys-media-landscape-after-20141/

wrfree
Guest

Insightful research on the ‘Kadarization’ of the media landscape in the country. Once again the muzzle of control and restrictions appear where state pressure exists to control media discourse and to increase self-censoring actions by individuals themselves. Same old same old. It is quite evident Orwell’s ghost wafts through all the nicks and crannies of Magyar society today. Magyars perhaps may not know it but truly the ‘freedom’ they are under is really slavery.

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