Acquiring a port on the Adriatic has long excited the imagination of Viktor Orbán. The idea was under consideration at the time of the first Orbán government (1998-2002), when the youthful prime minister was thinking of Rijeka as Hungary’s entry to the Adriatic, an obvious choice in historical terms. At least this is what Botond Szalma, former CEO of Mahart, the largest Hungarian shipping company in Hungary, remembers. Therefore, it was not surprising that, feeling flush after a few years of an economic boom, the Hungarian government revisited the issue of a port for Hungarian exporters and importers.
In January 2016, at a Slovenian-Hungarian summit, Viktor Orbán delivered a speech on the state of relations between the two countries. One of the topics was the Port of Koper, Slovenia’s only access to the Adriatic. For Hungary, Koper was the port of choice, but neither the port itself nor the railroad leading to it was adequate. Both would need major upgrades. If Slovenia decides to embark on modernization of the infrastructure, said Viktor Orbán, Hungary would be happy to join in the effort. At this point, however, it wasn’t even clear whether Slovenia wanted Hungary to take part in the project. Orbán indicated that further negotiations would take place regarding the possibility of Koper’s modernization.
More than a year later, in April 2017, Péter Szijjártó held negotiations in Slovenia with the prime minister, foreign minister, and minister and undersecretary responsible for infrastructure. “We agreed,” Szijjártó said, “that Hungary is ready to financially take part in the project in exchange for a long-term lease in the port of Koper that would ensure the presence of Hungarian companies at the Adriatic. In addition, Hungarian companies would be able to participate in the development of the rail connection.”
By the beginning of 2018, Magyar Nemzet triumphantly announced that the “end of the negotiations over Hungarian investment in Koper is imminent.” The Slovenian parliamentary committee on foreign affairs approved talks about the details, which would have included a €200 million investment to refurbish the port and the railroad line. The paper admitted that it wasn’t easy to get that far because the Slovenian opposition had been trying its best to thwart Hungarian participation in the project. But, for that amount of money, Hungary would have gotten a five-hectare parcel in the industrial park. The Hungarian side urged Slovenia to begin negotiations over the terms because the European Union had already promised €109 worth of assistance for the modernization of the railway line. Hungary said it would guarantee a €200 million investment for a 49% stake in the Divača-Koper railroad. Hungary would also guarantee a 2.8% profit.
A few months after this optimistic report Slovenia held its national election. Although Viktor Orbán’s friend, the right-wing Janez Janša of SDS, received the largest number of votes, he was unable to form a government. And the members of the new government didn’t forget that Viktor Orbán had backed Janša during the campaign and had ordered some of his oligarchs to purchase media outlets that supported Janša and his party. On October 24, 2018, Alenka Bratušek, deputy prime minister, said that the country was no longer interested in Hungary’s generous offer, which looked more and more like an opportunity for Lőrinc Mészáros’s company to build the Divača-Koper railroad. According to MTI, Bratušek said that “we don’t exclude cooperation with Hungary, but we are the ones who set the conditions for the Hungarians or anyone else.” The Slovenians wanted to know whether any country besides Hungary would be interested in investing in the project.
And thus ended Viktor Orbán’s attempt to get a lucrative business deal in Slovenia for his favorite oligarch. On November 16, 2018, the prime minister delivered a speech in which he talked disparagingly of Prime Minister Marjan Šarec, who before he entered politics had been a comedian and political satirist. Orbán expressed his astonishment that the Slovenes had elected “a local Fábry” to be prime minister. He was referring to Sándor Fábry, a well-known comedian in Hungary. He didn’t neglect to note that Šarec holds different views on the migration question than he does. He announced that nothing will come of Hungarian participation in the development of the port of Koper and improvement of the Divača-Koper railroad line. The Hungarian government will be taking a look at Trieste, which is only about 20 km from Koper.
Péter Szijjártó with Zeno D’Agostino, CEO of Trieste Port / MTI / Photo: Mitko Stojcev
At the beginning of June this year, Péter Szijjártó visited Italy. After a meeting with Interior Minister Matteo Salvini, he announced that the Hungarian government had purchased a 35-hectare parcel of land with a 300-meter waterfront for 31 million euros under a 60-year concession contract. Another 100 million euros will have to be spent on improvements. The government media outlets praised this incredible deal, which was facilitated by the very special relation Hungary and Italy have due to their similar ideological orientations. Hungary is grateful to the Italian government for supporting Hungary in its negotiations with the two private companies that sold the land to the Hungarian government.
The much-heralded port turned out to be a piece of land that had earlier been the site of an oil refinery. It has been sitting idle, undeveloped for years. So, if Hungary wants to have its own port, it will have to establish one. It will need a logistical center, and it may also have to clean up oil spillage, which is a very expensive proposition. The 100 million euros will not be enough for the kind of project Orbán and Szijjártó have in mind.
People familiar with shipping are baffled because, in their opinion, the site is not suitable to receive large container ships because of the insufficient length of the waterfront and the depth of the water, which at the would-be port is only 13 meters. It is also not entirely clear whether there is a suitable railway connection between Trieste and Zalaegerszeg, where the Hungarian hub is at the moment.
These potential problems notwithstanding, Pesti Srácok, just like all government sites, was thrilled at the news. As their headline announced: “Since Trianon it is the first time that we got to the Adriatic—The Italians helped—instead of Fiume [Rijeka] and Koper it is Trieste.”
Just my speculation and opinion from day one, when I read the news last week. With all due respect for those, who are happy with the new port on the Mediterranean, bringing back memories from the times of the Austro-Hungarian Monarchy, the new 300 meter wharf (or future port) is useless as a commercial port for container ships, tankers or regular commercial ships, as they are generally longer than 300 meters or require more than 300 meters shore to unload. However, the port can serve very well for small ships and yachts that carry contraband items, weapons, munitions, foodstuff to countries under embargo, etc., etc., etc.. Commercial trading companies in various countries, especially landlocked countries simply use the container rental companies or shippers to make arrangements for sea shipping, they don’t do it themselves. Since the port is Hungarian territory, sealed shipments from Hungary can travel to it without going thru Customs at the borders. For example, food shipment sold for cash to North Koreans that is being transferred in the high seas between ships, that is standard procedure for them, can bring prices ten times more than on the markets of Hungarian cities. Many of the Fidesz oligarchs are… Read more »
Maybe Putin’s admirals will eventually be eating lunch overlooking the Adriatic from Magyar territory. The partners will will probably figure out something with their heists and what to do with the land.
As a native Scandinavian, I feel slightly compelled to raise an indexfinger and point towards the sad record of sweetwater-shipmates like the Hungarians, who end up on the bottom of the 7 salty seas. Mind you, this is not funny – because there is no other consolation for those abandoned by shipwreck, than the compassion offered by the church!
And everything else considered, for Hungary or any other EU-state to pull off a newly won Gibraltar-status of any port, is about as likely as printing newspaper in hell – just sayin’.
A double-tracked line, recently upgraded, leaves Zalaegerszeg for Slovenia via Öriszentpéter. If that proves unsuitable for the new port, perhaps the track between Lendava and Rédics — 7km — could be restored.
With re-opening of the GYSEV line between Zalalövõ (between Öriszentpéter and Zalaegerszeg) and Körmend, a connection to Graz and a second connection to Szombathely — thence north to the new freight dépôts southeast of Vienna — would become available. Far easier to run trains through the Hungarian flatlands than across the Semmering watershed.
No, I shan’t live to see either.
Perhaps before this regime is embarking on such projects costing tens or even hundreds of millions of €’s, they should spend these funds on improving Hungary’s infrastructure, the state of hospitals, the welfare of the poorer half of the population, etc… The grandiose plans of Orban (the biggest thief amongst modern day ‘leaders’ in the EU) will hopefully come to nothing, although no one can be sure if those and other investments are just a cover to pocket more EU funds…
Dos, you are kidding! Welfare? Orbán is so proud having abolished this!
Since that new Hungarian port is too small for big container ships but good enough for smaller ones I propose to build a waterway so the yachts of the Fidesz oligarchs can easily go from the Balaton to the sea – just in case. 🙂
300 m should be enough for the “Lady M”.
Panamax II means a length up to 366 m, important for ships from China is Malaccamax: 470 m. Suez has no limits in length, but in width and heigth.
This facility is perfectly suited for one of the biggest business ventures on the international black market of the Mediterranean region these years: to supply Russian-owned small shippers with the embargoed goods which fuel Russian and Iranean involvement in the ongoing conflicts of the Middle East. This is a big business!
2017:
“Trieste is one of two Italian ports chosen by China to invest ”
(The other is Genova)
http://www.adriaports.com/en/trieste-one-two-italian-ports-chosen-china-invest
March 2019:
“Italy Signs on for Chinese “Belt and Road” Port Investments ”
“Critics of the Belt and Road initiative warn that Chinese development loans typically come with high interest rates, and the Chinese construction and business activities that follow may create new security risks from Chinese military or intelligence activity. ”
https://www.maritime-executive.com/article/italy-signs-on-for-chinese-belt-and-road-port-investments
http://www.portsofnapa.com/resources/files/pic/port_trieste-map.jpg
I’m really wondering why Fidesz wants that port in the crowded Triest with its crowded motorway – imho Koper or Rijeka/Fiume would be much better especially since Slovenia and Croatia now also have motorways and railways leading from the Alps (or the Hun border) to the coast.
Totally OT:
This map reminds me of our holidays in Yugoslavia in the 70s where we often took the Austrian and Italian motorways which ended just a few kms before Triest and already were crowded then. Then we’d have to take the regular road down into the city (!) and drive along the coast into Yugoslavia, usually via Koper to Porec or Vrsar.
Vrsar had the biggest nudist campsite: “Koversada”. Yugoslavia made a lot of money from us tourists but it was still much cheaper than Italy and probably still is today.
Those were the days!
👍👍
Musical interlude ..Gulliver bacsi in Trieste…the high seas await..new horizons beckon
https://youtu.be/_fJFoHZSD_k
China has more capital than it can invest at a reasonable rate of return. It’s a dilemma that the world has seen before. Really there is a problem with consumption of goods in China and consumption in both the EU and USA.
There are only so many things people need to buy beyond food and housing whether in Hungary or Germany. The decline in people buying updated cell phones on a regular basis is an example of that, with the advent of Uber and services like it an entire urban generation in the USA is going carless.
The entire Hungarian scheme relating to ports with direct transit access to Hungary is one of the more bizarre Orban national development ideas I have seen. I doubt the the consumption levels of the population of Hungary whether it is in energy or washing machines, etc merits this project for the costs involved.
…which is why GyB and other commentators are probably right that it is intended for O(rban’s) & O(ligarchs’) contraband & laundering activities…
Again I have to agree. Just for the sake of the environment our consumption of goods has to be reduced!
Cars are a good example, trucks might be the next – better connections to the ports via railways, but not the silly upgrade to Belgrad!
One of the problems there is the catastrophic situation of railways in Hungary – we see this regularly when traveling to BP e g. It’s cheap for us (tickets are free, we just pay the air condition surcharge. 🙂
But if you’re unlucky the train might get a delay of almost an hour.
And also of course the consumption of goods has to be reduced – by better longevity e g, not buying new cheap crap (like you see at Walmart etc) every year!
The costs of this venture will be many fold the € 31 mil or even the € 100 originally allocated for “improvements”:
– 300 m front and 12 depth will allow only smaller container ships up to 4k TEU (compare large 16k TEU, very large over 20k);
– a new terminal has to be built, even a smaller one should have ~ 200 000 TEU capacity to be viable (has to compare to Hu sea transport trade);
– all built with the involvement of the Orbàn mafia has huge cost overruns, up to 400%+;
– running a port/terminal requires a license, ie. a significant cost, potentially a prohibitive one in case of low usage;
– Hu gov guarantees 2.8% profit, while the return on investment has dropped by 40% last ten years to 5.5%.
https://theloadstar.com/fears-future-container-terminal-capacity-investors-get-cold-feet/
All indicates another half baked decision by half baked leaders, a decision with a big propaganda element too. My tip is that almost none of the main conditions for business feasibility has been met (nor studied for that matter) and that the project will flop burning hundreds of billions again, but who’s counting when we are reversing Trianon….
OT Boris Kalnoky best friend to Balog is already lying again. The election was secret so he can not know it, but he can write any shit.
383 votes for Ursula von der Leyen, only 9 votes more than she needed – and 13 came from Orbán / @ FideszEP. Good that she wanted it too, unlike @ManfredWeber
https://twitter.com/bkalnoky/status/1151188233902075904
Anyone who knows how Orbán is ticking, his desire to destroy the EU, his vindictive nature knows his temper, can understand it with logical reasoning himself. The motive, if UvdL had not been chosen, would be another stage victory for Orbán. The EU without leadership … alone the propaganda that could have been produced from it. Orbán certainly did not vote for UvdL, which is not his nature. … and Boris knows that very well …
Zeno D’Agostino, President of the Port System Authority of the Eastern Adriatic Sea – ESPO Vice President, interviewed at the conference: “Italy, logistics hub for Europe? That’s why.”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l6U0KwzwzTY
I mean where Orban is, … llogistics hub for Europe … that sounds damned after import export abuse … Missing Trader Intra- Community (MTIC) fraud … , is fraud too.
Amazing how for the past decade, everything that this government did was proclaimed to be a blunder on this site. Yet the economy has recovered since 2010, when Hungary was arguably the worst-off country in the EU, aside from Greece. Number of people employed rose from 3.6 million, to 4.3 million (excluding 200 k combined fostered workers and workers on placement abroad). Minimum wage almost doubled in Euro terms, Debt/GDP declined from 82% to about 68% and is forecast to decline to 65% next year. And most of it is no longer denominated in toxic FX. Most consumer debt is no longer toxic FX either. Since the 2013 recovery began, Hungary has one of the fastest-growing economies in the EU. Birth rates improved from bellow 1.25, to about 1.5. Eurostat estimated Hungary’s population declined by about 6,000 people in 2018, which means a net inflow of people who moved to Hungary last year of about 30,000. So that “exodus” story seems to be falling apart as well. https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/documents/2995521/9967985/3-10072019-BP-EN.pdf/e152399b-cb9e-4a42-a155-c5de6dfe25d1 If birth rates improve just a bit more, it seems Hungary’s population is set to stabilize. So setting aside the constant attacks against Hungary, by a liberal-globalist dominated Western elite structure, Hungary… Read more »
Sorry inflated parrot, I have been living in Hungary for 20 years and for ordinary people it has worsened a lot under Fidesz. Workers have less purchasing power than they did nine years ago, schools are much worse off than they were then, and health care is now underground. Hungary is the very last country of the V4 in terms of economic development. Once upon a time I was in Budapest to see a Theater piece, today you can only consider national crap an insult to the mind, just like you.
Hungary was already very last of the V4 by 2010, while in 2002 it was vying for first place with the Czechs.
As for buying power? Minimum wage increased from about 270 Euros/Month, to 460 since 2010. Hard to argue that buying power declined for anyone. Not to mention that there are now about 700,000 more people working in Hungary.
Zoli, have you ever been to a Hungarian hospital?
I’ve had that experience, accompanied a friend.
No more toilet paper!
Zoli
BS again these misleading/false figures which we have debunked several times. One example:
The GGDebt was 70.1% Q1 end according to MNB,
https://bbj.hu/economy/hungary-state-debt-at-701-of-gdp-at-the-end-of-q1_165789
The above doesn’t include the now permanent and huge deficits in the health, edu and smaller subsystems.
Add the 3000 bil. Huf private pension and the recent state pension assets lumped into the budget, ie. in pre 2010 terms the GGD is 81% just as it was 10 years ago.
Dear observer! If you want to talk economics, you better understand what you are talking about. Debt/GDP readings are always referenced in terms of end of year, because quarterly numbers can be very misleading. For instance a country that has financing requirements of 10% of GDP (deficit + refinancing) and decides to service all of it in the first quarter of the year, it may see an increase of 10%/GDP in its Debt/GDP ratio during that first quarter, which will then correct to real number by end of the year. Hungary happens to be a country that front-loads its financing requirements to the beginning of the year. The 68% value I referenced is the end of the year estimate for this year. End of last year was 71%. And even if you were right, it would still be a substantial improvement in trend compared with 2002-2010 period when it increased from 56%, to 82%. You debunked alright! More debunking! The Pension money did not go exclusively to paying down debt. Some of it is found in current state assets, such as MOL shares and so on. The pension effect ended in 2012, all the debt/GDP reduction since then is due… Read more »
Nine years ago, the white bread cost around 105 Ft., taday x3+ more than 300 for a kilo, drug co-payments have increased by more than 10 times since then. The earnings are 50% higher than they were nine years ago.
Twenty years ago a bread cost 90 Ft. Gasoline 165 Ft. Cement 1200 Ft. for 100kg. The merit was slightly less than in 2010.
And one thing I can tell you who pays less for bread lives cheaper … or.
https://tradingeconomics.com/hungary/food-inflation
Here is food price inflation in Hungary. It does not support your rant!
Because i am living in Hungary.
Yes, and Don Quixote used to slay “dragons”.
Zoli
The chart you linked shows a trend of great increase in the food prices inflation rate since 2015, now peaking at 5.8%.
I’m sure you you can spin this too, eg. less is more in Orbanistan.
Point was that it does not come close to increase in minimum wage I cited. Therefore Don Quixote was wrong to claim that cost of living outpaced increase in wages, which is utterly false. So given point I was making, don’t have to spin diddly. I never claimed there is no inflation. Perhaps in your mind I did!
Soli again, I live in Hungary you not.
Do you know the difference between nominal wage and net wage after taxes and social security?
And have you ever considered the pensions (nyugdi)?
You are really a horrible idiot, first claiming nonsense or isolated figures – and then of course ignoring corrections.
PS:
The statistical data comparing Hungary and other EU countries don’t look good for Hungary, whether it’s the happiness index, life expectancy or …
And don’t even think about the riches that O1G’s family and friends collect – there have been several examples quoted here.
So we can imagine who will profit from this project – whether it’s successful or not.
The data you are referring to has little to do with economic evolution since 2010. Using your logic, even if the country of Niger for instance were to quadruple salaries and GDP/capita in next decade, build infrastructure and improve health care, we should be able to dismiss it all, because after all, even after all that, they will still be one of the poorest countries on the planet. If one needs samples of idiotic arguments, this site is it!
No matter what statistics you try, all my neighbors are workers or retired and no one has got more as 50% increase since 2010 but the prices have gone up more than 50%. And now there is a new tax for transport which will be very expensive.
The police drive here three times a day and share hefty traffic tickets. For ten kilometers too fast 100 Euro.
So your argument is that empirical data is bunk, while your own anecdotal “facts” are golden?
Zoli if the minimum wage is 50 000 Ft. and your earning is 65 000Ft. and the minimum wage is raised by 10% you still earn 65,000 Ft.
Zoli, your “empirical data”, where you select just those that fit you and ignore the other facts are no better than our “anecdotal facts” – which are real.
Your “logic” reminds me of a story that my stats prof told us students more than 50 years ago:
A village with a thousand inhabitants has an average income of 1000 (doesn’t matter whether it’s Mark or Lire or Filler. Now a rich person (like O1G’s son in law) who makes a million per month builds his palace there – and the average income rises to almost 2000!
You surely have seen pictures of that palace – or the castle that O1G’s wife built in Eastern Hungary – my wife’s relatives often pass it but you can’t go near, TEK will send you away …
Again one last try:
What do you think of the riches of O1G’s family and friends – how did they make that much money?
While I focused on minimum wage, average wages have been growing by about 10%/year in the past few years. So you are once more fighting windmills.
Yes Zoli we know …
So you focus on those higher wages that are absorbed by tax increases and inflation and the fact that by inflating corruption a few oligarchs enrich themselves. Nothing else your numbers prove. Observer’s example with teacher’s wages are very comparable to other state employees. Those companies that can do so increase wages indeed in the hope that the exodus of workforce doesn’t hit their companies too hard. But these are mainly the export-orientated companies, because the local market doesn’t allow any higher price increase, and there are no advantages of exchange rates in favour of Euro or Dollar.
Many of our neighbours who are working and also those retired all have extra jobs where they work in the evening or over the weekend – just to make it through the month.
OT:
I’d be happy if the police here would check speeds and give tickets!
It regularly happens to me that a car passes me with at least 80 or 100 km/h – in the village!
But the driver of one of those black Audis or Mercedes usually is a cheating businessman, a Fidesz politician or a mafioso (often all of them in one person) not much happens …
Wolfi, welcome to low wage life! It is the typical story for most low income workers all over the Western World.
Wolfi in a police state like Hungary he gets no punishment, only you, because you have forgot your green insurance card or the receipt that you paid the car insurance.
To debunk the propaganda re increasing wages a group of teachers started to show their paychecks on FB: eg. uni degree holders take home HUF 130 – 150 k ($ 450 – 520 a month).
No comment, the fideszniks will spin it anyway.
Just because you managed to find a group of underpaid workers, namely teachers, it does not refute the wage growth data, it just shows that some were left behind, which in this case is rather unfortunate that it is teachers in particular. It is also a shameful aspect of the current government’s overall record. Having said that, it does not help you debunk anything we discussed. Only your own claim to actually having an understanding on the subject.
Like I already said, no shortage of mind-numbing, idiotic arguments on this site. But like I said, when the facts do not support your ideological thesis….
“no shortage of mind-numbing, idiotic arguments on this site”
Zoli, why do you repeat those idiotic arguments of the regime propaganda? If you wouldn’t do so we would have a lot less idiotic arguments here. I asked you to take some facts in account yesterday, but you prefer to repeat the same BS we hear from the regime day in day out.
OK! As I pointed out, inflation nowhere close to increase in wages. I backed it with statistical evidence. You call it BS, even though facts say otherwise. Not sure how you think that my facts-based arguments are idiotic, while you and the Eva minions who argue against the facts are right, and of course genius. So black is white?
You still insist that 28% of gross increase, which was about -0,25% nets – without calculating the negative effects of inflation – is a great extra value for the workers?
You still insist to tell us that the extreme effects of corruption that drive upwards the average income are a sign that everybody is sharing in economic growth, while there is hardly more than a stagnation in median incomes?
You still insist that 90,000 Hungarians in Austria, 280,000 in Germany and perhaps 350,000 in the UK together are the 200,000 that left Hungary?
So you still insist to spread the BS of regime propaganda.
Zoli your facts about Hungary and our personal experience in Hungary do not match. What could that be … are we or our neighbors or acquaintances just liars … just because you do not like that … just as Orbán does with Hungary … so you do it with us … do you not want to tell us from where you move your keyboard facts?
Zoli
Trying to muddy the water with intra year requirements, refinancing, etc. the end of the year figure was 70.8%.
Re the publishing of a Q1 figure go argue with Matolcsy.
Re the 3000 bil pension funds – Orbàn wants us to forget because “it ended in 2012”, but the simple fact is there was an earmarked reserve/asset equal to 11.5% GDP in 2010, Orbàn made it disappear, gone!
Zoli sounds more and more like Zoltanspox – who claims in his tweets that Hungary is even better than Finland! 🙂
Is this a coincidence? 🙂
Finland has place 1 on the World Happiness Index, Hungary is “unter ferner liefen” – place 62.
But zoli, sorry spox is sure:
@zoltanspox
Those rankings you use for reference carry their own bias. There’s no reliable benchmark by which you can measure traditions, institutions and differences in the EU28. Our record stands up to the test. Stop being hypocritical
If it weren’t so sad it would be funny! 🙂
Who needs toilet paper when you have christian values?
PS:
O1G’s father made an unbelievable amount of money with his company last year – but who cares …
“Zoli sounds more and more like Zoltanspox”
Wolfi, they use the same “arguments” and “statistics” to promote the same regime. Repeating nonsense again and again makes both believe that sooner or later it will get true.
Where did I argue that quarterly numbers should not be published? I take issue with your interpretation in regards to what they mean, which is a different story. Desperate, as always! I’d be desperate as well if the BS i’d be trying to use to justify ideological position were so weak.
And re the latest folly – “outlet to the sea”:
60% of Hu foreign trade is with neighbors and other continental EU contrives, Germany alone 24%. Add Russia’s oil and gas.
With China at 4.5% and some, ie. altogether less than 10% of trade may go for sea transport ! And we need our own terminal for this? Anybody seen a feasibility study or like? Or it’s again the genius of Felcsut who slapped his belly and got a decision ….
Can’t think of much better ways to run a country down and, yes, it’s already happening, @abouthungary bs notwithstanding.
Fidesz probably just wants a larger slice of the pie – when we travel on the M7 to or from Bp we see a lot of trucks from Poland, Romania, Latvia, Ukraine etc which obviously come from the Mediterranean sea or go there with their load.
The few Forints they pay as toll on the Hun motorway obviously is not enough.
Not too much OT:
When my wife worked in an exclusive boutique in Hévíz she often would accompany the owner to Lodz where warehouses stocked a lot of exclusive/expensive clothes delivered from China either via Triest or the North route via Gdansk).
If you consider the many miles this stuff had to travel from its production in China or Vietnam to Hévíz – where it was sold to mainly female DACH customers, fantastic in a way!
Yes, you do if you want to expand that trade. Can’t have it if you lack the logistics. First come the logistics! Your argument is like Niger saying “We export almost nothing, so why build any infrastructure?” Outright idiotic comment!
Zoli
BS again, there’s huge infrastructure in place for everyone to use, and the small Hu sea freight trade has been doing so for decades. One can buy services, no? you don’t have to own everything, eg. this is what the Orbàn minions said when they let Malev go under (and they were right).
Were they lying then, or now, or double standards? C’mon, go tell these to the kids.
Re “expand trade” – the “opening to to the east” drive and the “Trading Houses” were more failures in the series of primitive econ ideas, the volumes didn’t raise, while costs were sunk in the scheme, which is being rolled back btw.
Felcsutia all over.
There is a difference between available, and practical, economical or viable. No, you do not have to own everything, but it helps to improve logistics by doing some targeted planning.
“There is a difference between available, and practical, economical or viable.”
Explain, why a berth too small for most vessels would be practical, economical or viable.
Trieste is officially a deep water port. Deep water ports are classified as anything deeper than 30 feet. Trieste cargo pier is 36-40 feet deep. It might not accommodate all vessels out there, but it is deep enough for commercial shipping. I know Eva threw out that red herring of an argument, but….
Furthermore, the channel is over 56 feet deep, so nothing stops Hungary from making the pier deeper, thus expanding capacity.
In conclusion, it is a viable commercial port, which can meet most cargo transport needs.
Trieszt has a huge and growing port, nothing wrong with that. China bought a big share of it and is investing hundreds of billions of Euro, but obviously not that abandoned piece of land nobody wanted to own since a very long time. Even if next to the pier may be digged (I don’t know the contract, Szijjártó talked only about having bought the land), it is too short for only one vessel. Nothing against the entire port, but that tiny part, we are talking about is absurd!
Zoli
Trieste is ..deep water port ….
Rijeka is …
Pireus is …
What do these have to do with the 300 m long and 12 m deep HUN! waterfront? (The gall of the BS-ter emeritus mentioning red herrings)
Tell us what is the current and Kakaska’s “targeted planned” volume of sea freight Hu trade;
tell us what size container ships steam to India , China.
wolfi
The project is emphasized as HUNGARIAN (owned), for Hu export, outlet to the sea again, Trianon, etc. not as a new profitable business idea (which is not a function of the state anyway and where the Orbàn regime and its clients have markedly incapable of).
I didn’t mention corruption as there are no signs yet, although Orbàn = corruption and his insistence upon the Mèszàros participation in the failed Slovenian deal confirms his intention.
And just now
MICROSOFT admitted to a huge bribery case involving its Hu managers in gov procurement contracts (of course) and accepted to pay $ 25 million in settlement.
https://fortune.com/2019/07/22/microsoft-federal-corruption-charges-hungarian-bribery-scheme/
Wonderful! Minimum wages increased! I still remember that one increase of 28%. Great success, wonderful for all workers with a low income! Really? The increase of 28% was nets -600 Ft if full time working. Side effect of the flat tax Orbán introduced. How happy those people must be to finance the lower taxes for oligarchs. Even more those who had a little more and got a big set back nets. And what about the total increase compared to the inflation of food? Don’t use average for comparing the income of 2009 and 2019! Try the median. If the income is generated fairly these 2 should be about the same, but it is not. Why should we be happy with the enrichment of the ruling mafia? You don’t pay them, I have to! Hungary is with most economic figures on a great 2nd place in EU ranking – 2nd from the end of course. Great, Orbán finally handled the forex credit problems – but please also tell within the same sentence that he created and promoted this himself! Don’t use wrong numbers! There is still a regulation that 350,000 közmunkas should be (I know mayors that don’t get enough for… Read more »
OT:
Almost missed this:
A scathing article on O1G and László Kiss-Rigó, the bishop of Szeged and their “Chritian values” – of course they don’t agree with the humanitarian ideas of the Pope who was described by O1G’s old friend:
Zsolt Bayer, said in 2016 that the pope was “either a senile old fool or a scoundrel” for his pro-refugee sentiments.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jul/14/viktor-orban-budapest-hungary-christianity-with-a-twist
Maybe now you understand why I detest those so-called Christians …
Results of the Ukrainian election in the districts partly inhabited by ethnic Hungarians at 80% of the precincts reporting.
districts #68; #69; #73 around
Ужгород (Ungvár); Берегове (Beregszász); Виноградів (Nagyszőlős):
Zelensky’s party: 44.38%; 50.71%; 50.04%
Timoshenko’s party: 9.24%; 8.87%; 9.49%
Poroshenko’s party: 7.16%; 4.65%; 2.71%
Vakarchuk’s party: 6.97%; 5.24; 2.97%
Boyko’s party [pro-Russian]: 6.91%; 10.32%; 6.52%
Individual candidates:
#68 (91% reporting)
1. Pekar (Zelensky’s) 19.17%
2. Horvath Robert (Independent) 18.67%
3. Andriiv (Independent) 17.84%
4. Barta Jozsef (Hungarian Kárpátaljai Magyar Kulturális Szövetség [KMKSz] as independent) 13.18%
#69 (100% reporting)
1. Balog Viktor (United Center party) 35.81%
2. Tokar (Zelensky’s) 34.47%
3. Toth Miklos (Hungarian Ukrajnai Magyar Demokrata Szövetség [UMDSz] as independent ) 11.70%
#73 (70% reporting)
1. Polyak (Independent) 41.16%
2. Brenzovics Vaszil (Hungarian Kárpátaljai Magyar Kulturális Szövetség [KMKSz] as independent) 27.61%
3. Margitich (Zelensky’s) 10.94%
4. Balog Pal ((United Center party) 10.25%
https://www.cvk.gov.ua/pls/vnd2019/wp306_npt001f01=919pid100=21.html
https://kiszo.net/2019/07/22/egyeni-keruletek-szoros-befuto-ungvaron-es-munkacson/
Update: Independent Robert Horvath leads in district #68 by 262 votes. (97.91% of the precincts reporting)
He is not the candidate of either official Hungarian organizations.
https://www.cvk.gov.ua/pls/vnd2019/wp040pt001f01=919pf7331=68.html
Yet again we see the ghost of the Chilean cherry rearing its ugly head. Sure, I remember being among those who laughed at that 2 decades ago, but back then it wasn’t so obvious that Hungary, like other countries in the region would rather build a trade post on Mars than to establish a functioning free trade with neighboring countries, a cornerstone of economy for any country living on land and in peace time. Imagine for a moment if the world economy worked like Eastern Europe does, “you elected a politician I don’t like/can’t bribe/control, therefore I select not to do business with you”. This is why the base contract was signed in Rome, not Bucuresti in 1957, even if the Red Army hadn’t occupied the other half of Europe, we have statistics of the interwar period as indicator on how autocrats backed by their elite even their societies rather did business with fascists and Nazis, than with their closest neighbors. Mr. Szíjjártó said that Italy is a marvelous choice as they are Hungary’s fifth largest trade partner. For the benefit of the doubt, obviously Hungary’s 8 neighbors don’t possess the same economic power, yet we all know, Hungary’s number… Read more »
OT:
You couldn’t invent this …
@V4Agency
It turned out again that pro-migration forces want to make the world’s most dangerous migration document, the @UN #Global #Compact for #Migration, mandatory, #Hungarian #Foreign Minister Peter #Szijjarto said
Of course the UN is a really dangerous organisation – maybe financed by Satan Soros? :
Wolfi
I’m trembling at the thought that the “clandestine power” and the “world gov of the Illuminati” may merge with those “pro migration forces” and with the Freemasons and then the good old Christian Huns may lose the battle for ….. whatever … although Orbàn always wins ….
Stupefying nonsense, ie. Felcsutia!
That’s probably because O1g etc belong to the group of our reptilian overlords …
This is one of our favourite conspiracies championed by on one of our favourite conspiracy theorists, David Icke. We’re talking of course about the Reptilian Overlords that have been controlling the human race since ancient times.
The theory involves a race of extraterrestrials from the star Alpha Draconis in the Draco constellation. Unlike humans, the Reptilians are a group of beings who are very unemotional while also being very logical and hierarchical. They are said to be behind secret societies like the Freemasons and the Illuminati and have the Queen, Bill Clinton, the Bush family, Barack Obama, John Kerry, Brad Pitt, Madonna, Marilyn Monroe, and Tom Hanks amongst their ranks.
Oh wait – isn’t Soros the king of lizards?
http://pilerats.com/shit-weve-done/love-a-good-conspiracy-theory-reptilian-overlords/
Wolfi, it would mean that Hungarian migrants abroad have the RIGHT to be treated better than we are treated by the regime at home. Bad enough that they are already better off, but making that a right? No way! Dangerous!
And now back to reality:
@EuroSandor
Hu anti corruption campaigner @hadhazyakos
flew over the domein used by the Orbán family to see new constructions. Fyi: the property belongs to Orbán’s father Győző Orbán and Hungary’s richest oligarch Lőrincz Mészáros is leasing from him, so that the PM’s family can relax.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EAD-jZAXkAI9JpC?format=jpg&name=900×900
Click on the link to display.
Nice isn’t it?
And that’s in addition to other places the O1G family owns/uses …
Who pays for all this?
I know it’s a stupid question …